[SamBo]

Underboring is better from what we know correct? Well what if paintball markers actual chamber was underbored? Would this create chops from the edge of the feedneck hole where the ball is dropped in? Would there be enough of an efficiency gain to even tell? What is the current bore of paintball markers' chambers?

[gibbeepbroxzor]

if the chamber was underbored, the bolt wouldnt go through it..... and underboring works because its pressed into the breach. the tension of a hopper probably couldnt push it down past the feedneck..

[andrewthewookie]

An underbored chamber would be pointless, since the bolt closes through it, and the paintball experiences the expanding gas once it's already in the barrel.

[Troy]

The bolt does not have to be as big as the ball to seal in a chamber. Think about designing a chamber with a chamfer... kinda like a funnel. The bolt and ball could fit in the breach loosely until the bolt pushes the ball far enough into the "funnel" to seal, and the bolt could be slightly larger then the inner diameter of the bore, so it seals on the chamfer (the sloped part). A side benefit as well would be the fact that the sloped edges are MUCH easier to seal, then the two parallel surfaces, and the bolt seal would be very superior to any other method. It wouldn't be a big deal, imo.

Of course, this would require you to match the bolt and the chamber to your paint, have fun finding people that want to do that.

This post has been edited by Troy: 29 August 2012 - 04:59 PM

[tyronejk]

Troy, on 29 August 2012 - 04:53 PM, said:

The bolt does not have to be as big as the ball to seal in a chamber. Think about designing a chamber with a chamfer... kinda like a funnel. The bolt and ball could fit in the breach loosely until the bolt pushes the ball far enough into the "funnel" to seal, and the bolt could be slightly larger then the inner diameter of the bore, so it seals on the chamfer (the sloped part). A side benefit as well would be the fact that the sloped edges are MUCH easier to seal, then the two parallel surfaces, and the bolt seal would be very superior to any other method. It wouldn't be a big deal, imo.

Of course, this would require you to match the bolt and the chamber to your paint, have fun finding people that want to do that.

The firing chamber in real guns aren't the same as the "chambers" in paintball markers. The chamber in firearms is where the rounds explode and propel the bullet down the barrel. The chamber in a paintball marker is just the space where paintballs drop down before being fired. The ball is only fired once the bolt pushes it into the barrel. The ball isn't fired from the chamber.

IT IS COMPLETELY USELESS TO MATCH YOUR BOLT/CHAMBER TO YOUR PAINT.

[Troy]

tyronejk, on 29 August 2012 - 06:02 PM, said:

Troy, on 29 August 2012 - 04:53 PM, said:

The bolt does not have to be as big as the ball to seal in a chamber. Think about designing a chamber with a chamfer... kinda like a funnel. The bolt and ball could fit in the breach loosely until the bolt pushes the ball far enough into the "funnel" to seal, and the bolt could be slightly larger then the inner diameter of the bore, so it seals on the chamfer (the sloped part). A side benefit as well would be the fact that the sloped edges are MUCH easier to seal, then the two parallel surfaces, and the bolt seal would be very superior to any other method. It wouldn't be a big deal, imo.

Of course, this would require you to match the bolt and the chamber to your paint, have fun finding people that want to do that.

The firing chamber in real guns aren't the same as the "chambers" in paintball markers. The chamber in firearms is where the rounds explode and propel the bullet down the barrel. The chamber in a paintball marker is just the space where paintballs drop down before being fired. The ball is only fired once the bolt pushes it into the barrel. The ball isn't fired from the chamber.

IT IS COMPLETELY USELESS TO MATCH YOUR BOLT/CHAMBER TO YOUR PAINT.

You're new, so I'll be gentle... your post is not constructive. We all know how paintball markers operate, you don't need to explain to us how how compressed gas expands to push the paintball out of the business end either.

We know two things:
1) Bolts seal the chamber to stop air flow out of the feedneck
2) an underbored barrel is more efficient then an overbored barrel

It stands to reason that if the ball is sealed in a breach/barrel/chamber/whatever (do keep in mind that in most markers there is a spot where the ball rests when the bolt is fully extended before it reaches the barrel... most people refer to this as the "chamber" still, even though it doesn't exist in the same vertical space of the feedneck) BEFORE it gets hit by the power pulse, which just so happens to be the time when the most air hits the ball at once, the whole system will be more efficient.

So, before you go off half cocked, make sure you know what your talking about. If you have constructive things to say, I'm sure, I speak for everyone when I say that I want to hear them... otherwise, keep those thoughts to yourself.

[ShadowZero]

andrewthewookie, on 29 August 2012 - 04:08 PM, said:

An underbored chamber would be pointless, since the bolt closes through it, and the paintball experiences the expanding gas once it's already in the barrel.

You guys are arguing even though the solution to this is right here.

[tyronejk]

Troy, on 30 August 2012 - 07:20 AM, said:

tyronejk, on 29 August 2012 - 06:02 PM, said:

Troy, on 29 August 2012 - 04:53 PM, said:

The bolt does not have to be as big as the ball to seal in a chamber. Think about designing a chamber with a chamfer... kinda like a funnel. The bolt and ball could fit in the breach loosely until the bolt pushes the ball far enough into the "funnel" to seal, and the bolt could be slightly larger then the inner diameter of the bore, so it seals on the chamfer (the sloped part). A side benefit as well would be the fact that the sloped edges are MUCH easier to seal, then the two parallel surfaces, and the bolt seal would be very superior to any other method. It wouldn't be a big deal, imo.

Of course, this would require you to match the bolt and the chamber to your paint, have fun finding people that want to do that.

The firing chamber in real guns aren't the same as the "chambers" in paintball markers. The chamber in firearms is where the rounds explode and propel the bullet down the barrel. The chamber in a paintball marker is just the space where paintballs drop down before being fired. The ball is only fired once the bolt pushes it into the barrel. The ball isn't fired from the chamber.

IT IS COMPLETELY USELESS TO MATCH YOUR BOLT/CHAMBER TO YOUR PAINT.

You're new, so I'll be gentle... your post is not constructive. We all know how paintball markers operate, you don't need to explain to us how how compressed gas expands to push the paintball out of the business end either.

We know two things:
1) Bolts seal the chamber to stop air flow out of the feedneck
2) an underbored barrel is more efficient then an overbored barrel

It stands to reason that if the ball is sealed in a breach/barrel/chamber/whatever (do keep in mind that in most markers there is a spot where the ball rests when the bolt is fully extended before it reaches the barrel... most people refer to this as the "chamber" still, even though it doesn't exist in the same vertical space of the feedneck) BEFORE it gets hit by the power pulse, which just so happens to be the time when the most air hits the ball at once, the whole system will be more efficient.

So, before you go off half cocked, make sure you know what your talking about. If you have constructive things to say, I'm sure, I speak for everyone when I say that I want to hear them... otherwise, keep those thoughts to yourself.

Great comeback. I like the subtle reference implied in "half cocked [sic]."

ShadowZero, on 01 September 2012 - 03:05 PM, said:

andrewthewookie, on 29 August 2012 - 04:08 PM, said:

An underbored chamber would be pointless, since the bolt closes through it, and the paintball experiences the expanding gas once it's already in the barrel.

You guys are arguing even though the solution to this is right here.

But it looks like my side has more supporters.

[Troy]

tyronejk, on 02 September 2012 - 04:51 PM, said:

But it looks like my side has more supporters.

I think Lord Odin's test using different barrel adapters in combination with different freak backs give us ample reason to believe that there is SOMETHING that can be made different in the breach/chamber to increase efficiency/consistency over the chrono. IIRC he hypothesized that different inner diameters allowed the bolt to travel further into the adapter, but I think that it's also a reasonable hypothesis that the inner diameter of the adapters would change the shot regardless of bolt interaction.

[lovebunny]

why not underbore a hopper?

[crich775]

For the small benefit that it may or may not bring to the table, would it be worth it to have to go and buy multiple bodies, if not entire markers, for the different paint? Theoretics and laboratory testing are a whole 'nother ballpark compared to real world usability.

[SamBo]

^^^ You wouldn't have to if the entire breech was bored at say 684 that is plenty small for the biggest paint on the market. You wouldn't have to switch bodies. But it doesn't matter because the paintball isn't propelled until its in the barrel anyway.

Quote

why not underbore a hopper?

What?? So balls wouldn't go through? Theres nothing to propel the paint through the hopper. I guess if it's force fed, but this would only work against the motor.

andrewthewookie, on 29 August 2012 - 04:08 PM, said:

An underbored chamber would be pointless, since the bolt closes through it, and the paintball experiences the expanding gas once it's already in the barrel.

This makes sense I didn't think about it. But yes because no air is being used till it's in the barrel.

[bigx]

Or you could buy a G6R and tune it for max efficiency and run it with a 90/4500 SLP Tank. You can shoot forever problem solved.

[Red Infinity]

Like the insert body for a t2?

This post has been edited by Red Infinity: 15 October 2012 - 10:03 AM

[Lunatic_on_high]

lovebunny, on 05 September 2012 - 09:52 PM, said:

why not underbore a hopper?

underbore your pods, maybe even underbore your airtank for all dem efficiency gains



Hey guys I've got a great idear, if we want to be mroe efficient why dont we have smaller paint... oh wait

[Eskimo]

lovebunny, on 05 September 2012 - 09:52 PM, said:

why not underbore a hopper?

LoveNubby is on the the right track, paintballs swell like crazy once the heat gets to em and moisture. Underbore the hopper and put a replaceable ice layer on the outside to ensure cold balls. And we can place a few thin iron rings with coils around to create a magnetic field to repel the H20 molecules away from the hopper.



Thats how science works right?

Also: I want a 50.Cal Stock class marker. Why many people scream, WHY?
because your playing up close anyways, a 12 paintball stick feed would fit like 20 paintballs in a staggered fashion. and 12 efficiancy would be boss. A smaller bolt and internals = less friction and a smaller spring means easier pump stroke.

(last comment is relationship to the smaller paint argument)

This post has been edited by Eskimo: 15 October 2012 - 12:35 PM

[Troy]

I think we should put some iron filings in the paint, and then use magnetic rings to launch them.... can you say rail gun?

[cockerpunk]

k this is done