[unfated33]

Right now I have an Azodin Kaos-D, and whatever my next purchase might be (Automag, Cocker, Mech Ion, eNMEy), it will also be a mechanical marker. I've been thinking about getting a new hopper because I find myself needing to regularly clean out my Proto Primo and I'd like easier access inside. I don't need blistering feed speed - anything over about 8 bps is going to do. In fact, other than maintenance on the Primo, I'm quite happy with that loader. I've used the Dye Rotor on occasion, and while it works simply and cleans easily, it seems to take a lot of batteries and makes my marker quite heavy - so I guess weight is a motivating factor. Last major issue for me is that I really don't want to spend a lot of money on an electric loader for a mechanical marker. Oh, and if I'm buying, it'd be new condition.

I don't know if it will be helpful to anyone else, but I just wanted to talk out loud about the types of loaders on the market and what I'm thinking about buying.

Dye Rotor/Virtue Spire/Empire Prophecy Z2 - I think all three of these loaders look great and check the box for easy disassembly and cleaning. Of the three, the Virtue Spire interests me the most but also has the most prohibitive cost at $185. The rotor ($180) is way too heavy for my style of play and would reduce ammo capacity slightly. The Proto Primo holds about 200 balls, and both the Spire and Prophecy ($150) would provide more ammo before reloading.

Pinokio - This loader is very tempting, especially at its current ANSGear price of $90. Since the front nose can be removed that gives cleaning access inside the shell, though I'm not sure how easy the extended cone would be to clean if I ever used that. From what I've heard a Pinokio can go 30+ cases before changing batteries, it's light, and it's easier to clean than the Primo. With the extended nose cone, I could conceivably take a lot of paint with me on to the field without having to go back to reload between rounds. The one hangup I have here is that $90 still would be a lot to spend for these features compared to what I've already invested in my Primo.

Valken V-Max - I know a lot of people strongly dislike the v-max, but at it's current price of $60 I have to strongly consider it. The feedrate is more than sufficient for my mechanical marker. It has easy toolless disassembly for cleaning. Low profile. It's very light, perhaps the lightest hopper on the market. The V-max holds just a bit more ammo than my Primo. What I don't know is how long the batteries last before replacement and whether a paddle sensor is impacted by a mechanical marker (my guess is that it isn't).

Empire Scion/Empire Halo Too - The Halo Too seems to be the midrange hopper industry standard. The Scion is the next generation of Halo/Prophecy hoppers with the Z2 internals. The price of these is slightly prohibitive at $85-85 for the Halo and $100 for the Scion. Neither hopper has easy access for disassembly. I don't know about the weight of the Scion, but Halo's are a bit heavier than the other hoppers I'd prefer to choose. The Scion's weight is probably close to the same. Ammo capacity in both is going to be about 20 balls less than the Primo. While these may be great choices for many people, these hoppers fail for my selection criteria.

Tippman SSL-200/Spyder Fasta - These similar loaders look a lot like budget Pinokio's, and in many ways that's exactly what you get. The SSL-200 runs $45 new and the Fasta comes in three varieties: 9V LED for $45, 18V LED for $65, and 18V LCD for $75. With a 230 ball capacity, the Fasta would give a slight edge in ammo compared to the Primo. The SSL-200 would provide no ammo gains. Both loaders are lightweight, but neither would help any with quick disassembly. The price is a positive, but the main thing I'm looking for (cleaning) would still be lacking with a purchase of one of these hoppers.

Viewloader Revolution CAT - A dirt cheap loader at $13, but the constant agitation wouldn't be so good for woodsball and there's no easy cleanup of the internals. I have no idea what they weigh, but with a 180 ball capacity there's just nothing about this hopper that interests me.


In summary, what I see is that my choice comes down to either the Valken V-Max at $60, Pinokio at $90, or going over the top to buy a Spire at $185 or Prophecy Z2 at $150. Well, and the choice of doing nothing but staying in my current state with the Proto Primo. I'd love to say I'm going to run out to get the Pinokio at its current price, but the truth is that the v-max looks like a good option for what I need. Care to talk me out of it?

[kingJurzy]

unfated33, on 02 January 2013 - 11:45 AM, said:

The Proto Primo holds about 200 balls, and both the Spire and Prophecy ($150) would provide more ammo before reloading.

The Z2 holds 165 balls whereas the Spire holds 200+.

In your situation a Pinokio or a V-max would be sufficient in what you need it for. The Pinokio would cause less double feeds because of the soft membrane that spins the motor. The balls need to push that membrane down before the motor starts spinning and this is the best system for mech markers in my opinion.

The V-max is a superloader gone bad. Although it can handle 12bps consistently it was advertised at 30+ bps and that is a no-no because of product failure. This loader does weigh under 1 pound with batteries in it though. Do not quote me on this but the V-max's drive system appears to be a turnwheel of some sort that turns when it catches a ball and that activates the motor. This looks bad because of the opportunity to break a ball in the loader on one of the various turntable spikes if it is forced down there.

The Spire is the Rolls Royce out of these 3. I HAVE gotten consistent double feeds from this marker on a mech cocker and an E1 cocker but that is only when I go to reload from empty and the balls just shoot right out. It is an amazing loader and I would take it over the V-max's system of running the motor.



All in all I say buy a used Spire or a used Pinokio and just be done with it.

[unfated33]

kingJurzy, on 02 January 2013 - 12:16 PM, said:

unfated33, on 02 January 2013 - 11:45 AM, said:

The Proto Primo holds about 200 balls, and both the Spire and Prophecy ($150) would provide more ammo before reloading.

The Z2 holds 165 balls whereas the Spire holds 200+.

In your situation a Pinokio or a V-max would be sufficient in what you need it for. The Pinokio would cause less double feeds because of the soft membrane that spins the motor. The balls need to push that membrane down before the motor starts spinning and this is the best system for mech markers in my opinion.

The V-max is a superloader gone bad. Although it can handle 12bps consistently it was advertised at 30+ bps and that is a no-no because of product failure. This loader does weigh under 1 pound with batteries in it though. Do not quote me on this but the V-max's drive system appears to be a turnwheel of some sort that turns when it catches a ball and that activates the motor. This looks bad because of the opportunity to break a ball in the loader on one of the various turntable spikes if it is forced down there.

The Spire is the Rolls Royce out of these 3. I HAVE gotten consistent double feeds from this marker on a mech cocker and an E1 cocker but that is only when I go to reload from empty and the balls just shoot right out. It is an amazing loader and I would take it over the V-max's system of running the motor.



All in all I say buy a used Spire or a used Pinokio and just be done with it.

Ah, didn't know the base Z2 held so few. So the only way to get 200 or 280 balls is to buy one of the extended nose cones. Thanks for the advice.

[XxJellyFilledxX]

My vote goes to the vmax in this case. It will feed fast enough for your needs while still being lighter and more durable than the nokio and on par with the other loaders.

But in honesty any loader you pick from this list will serve you well enough for the job.

This post has been edited by XxJellyFilledxX: 02 January 2013 - 12:47 PM

[kingJurzy]

Spire does hold 200+ balls if you ask really nicely I can count how many fit in there.

I did like my Pinokio when I had it. It was stupid simple to operate and took 3 minutes to undo all of the screws.

[Garribean]

I would just go with the Rotor, It holds about 185-195 Balls(I hand counted mine and packed it to the brim) Put Batteries in, Put paint in, stick it on your Marker, and you're good to go. No messing with settings of any sort. Turn On, Turn Off. Simple.

And Really isn't all that heavy, but of course it is when you compare it to the Primo, That thing is nothing! haha But on the field, you don't notice nor does it affect anything.

Plus if you get the Rotor, You will NEVER need any other hopper for the rest of your paintball career.

This post has been edited by Garribean: 02 January 2013 - 01:17 PM

[Karnokr]

Not as easy to clean as a Rotor or Z2, but a simple Empire/Invert Reloader 2 is a great mechanical gun loader. I bought my last one for my pump on eBay for $21 shipped. And it was new! Takes 2 9-volt batteries.

I haven't seen one in person, but the Overdrive at $35-40 would be a good cheap loader too.

This post has been edited by Karnokr: 02 January 2013 - 01:40 PM

[paintballguy2255]

If you a sticking mech,then a revvy would suit your needs perfectly(the old one,not the cat).But,if you want a loader,then I recommend the pinokio,as it is lightweight,easy to maintain/clean,and it is only $90.Plus,you have the added capability of the nose cone,whic allows you to hold about 400 balls for a scenario or a day where you just wanna carry 400 balls.Even without the nose cone,it holds about 230 balls,which is more than most loaders.Overall,it seems to suit your needs perfectly.

[Jarz]

The original Revvy can be had for around $20, and they aren't that hard to clean, in my opinion. You seem to want high-end loader features on a new loader without paying the high-end price. Honestly, if you're on a budget, the Primo is going to be about as good as it can get. Maybe buy a second one, so if one gets messy during a day of play, you run some water through it, and while it's drying, you have another loader.

[tallsmallboy44]

Garribean, on 02 January 2013 - 01:11 PM, said:

I would just go with the Rotor, It holds about 185-195 Balls(I hand counted mine and packed it to the brim) Put Batteries in, Put paint in, stick it on your Marker, and you're good to go. No messing with settings of any sort. Turn On, Turn Off. Simple.

And Really isn't all that heavy, but of course it is when you compare it to the Primo, That thing is nothing! haha But on the field, you don't notice nor does it affect anything.

Plus if you get the Rotor, You will NEVER need any other hopper for the rest of your paintball career.

This applies to pretty much every superloader.

[Matrixrail_Louie]

Garribean, on 02 January 2013 - 01:11 PM, said:

I would just go with the Rotor, It holds about 185-195 Balls(I hand counted mine and packed it to the brim) Put Batteries in, Put paint in, stick it on your Marker, and you're good to go. No messing with settings of any sort. Turn On, Turn Off. Simple.

And Really isn't all that heavy, but of course it is when you compare it to the Primo, That thing is nothing! haha But on the field, you don't notice nor does it affect anything.

Plus if you get the Rotor, You will NEVER need any other hopper for the rest of your paintball career.

This lol its like a tank

[Dakent]

Rotor. It's really not that heavy, it's super durable. Won't crack when it hits a tree, etc. If you take care of it, it wont jam. You can get them super cheap to if you decided not to go new.

[HU Soldier]

How about a vlocity?? surely with the giant opening you can clean it easily enough....;

[unfated33]

Jarz, on 02 January 2013 - 02:05 PM, said:

The original Revvy can be had for around $20, and they aren't that hard to clean, in my opinion. You seem to want high-end loader features on a new loader without paying the high-end price. Honestly, if you're on a budget, the Primo is going to be about as good as it can get. Maybe buy a second one, so if one gets messy during a day of play, you run some water through it, and while it's drying, you have another loader.

Perhaps it's big dreams on a budget price... I guess I just think of the high end loaders as being about speed, and feed speed is really the least of my concerns for play. The toolless disassembly and cleaning is the number 1 item, but you're right that it's a feature not found on nearly all of the loaders under $100. You probably wouldn't see the v-max in this price range if the feed speed and reliability had been as advertised, leaving only the older Pinokio.

Buying a second Primo is a reasonable idea that I hadn't even considered, but I'm going to chew on that one for a while. On the positive side, I can easily switch over during a play day without having to stop to clean up. On the negative side, now I'd have two hoppers with tiny screws still to contend with. For the price, it gives me twice the flexibility for not much more cost than the do-nothing option.

As for the original revolution, can they still be purchased new in the box? I've thought about both the revolution and the velocity/jr., but again I'd really prefer to buy new if possible. I like knowing that any problems it has are either my own fault or the factory's, possibly with a warranty thrown in for good measure.

Thanks.

[Jarz]

I doubt any Revvys are unused, but JT re-released the Revvy, but it's been hard to find (mostly appearing at sporting goods stores). If you have two Primos, since there are no electronics, just spray them down with water at the end of the day, then let them dry out.

[paintballguy2255]

Jarz, on 02 January 2013 - 09:49 PM, said:

I doubt any Revvys are unused, but JT re-released the Revvy, but it's been hard to find (mostly appearing at sporting goods stores). If you have two Primos, since there are no electronics, just spray them down with water at the end of the day, then let them dry out.

Or he could keep his primo and buy a revvy,then use the revvy as his main and primo as his backup.It may not be a spray 'n clean loader,but the old thick shell ones are pretty damn solid and will keep up with pretty much every mech on the market.And it isn't as hard to clean as it may seem.It takes me around 5 minutes at the end of the day to take mine apart,wipe it down,and put back together.

[III Kezia III]

There seems to be no reason to get a rotor, a z2, or a spire if your going to be using a mech marker for your next gun as well. While the whole point of this is to find a hopper that is easy to clean, and disassemble you could really just save yourself a bunch of money if you find a old school revvy. Not that CAT one but the one with break beam eyes or the one that was sound activated i forgot which one the older revvy's used but they're about 20 dollars now and honestly they work extremely well. They can easily keep up with that 8bps your looking for. Do yourself a favor and check to see if you can find one used. Definitely worth the money if you find one. other than that the next one would be the Halo too hopper then the pinokio then the scion in terms of price.

[dannyboy768]

http://www.baccipaintball.com/



^This site sells used Revys dirt cheap. They are the best, 11 bps pretty consistently, never jams, super light.

[Antonious]

For any mech other than an RT Automag, a good ol' revvy (non-CAT) should be all you need. I got mine for $25 and it's just as reliable as my Rotor.
The Primo works well for pumps and kicky blow-backs, but if you're marker shoots relatively smooth, it may have problems keeping up. I tried it with my Mag once and it didn't work all too well, even when shooting quite slow.
If you do end up getting an RT Mag, I would suggest going with one of the "super-loaders" as it'll likely end up out-shooting the revvy. I currently use a Rotor on my Mag and I've no complaints. I've never taken a look at the Z2 or the Spire much since I have really no desire to swap loaders. They all get the job done just fine.

[TinyBear]

I opted for a invert too originally for my RT ULE Automag but I disliked its pita maintenance so recently replaced it with a Z2. But if you don't intend to shoot something electro or RT'd why not opt for the VALKEN V-MAX. It seems best suited to what ya want checks off all the boxes.