[Poe]

Are the Flatline barrels less accurate then traditional barrels at close range, mid range and/or long range? By 'long range' I mean long range for a traditional barrel.

Reason for the question...
I was at the field watching two guys shoot a Flatline. They were impressed with the range but noted its inaccuracy. The gentleman owning the Flatline had this to say (summarized):

Flatline barrels sacrifice accuracy for range for two reasons:
1. Crosswinds alter the spin induced force causing sporadic results on windy days.
2. Not all balls are spun at the same rate so range is not consistent.

Those statements made sense I suppose, but it appeared just as accurate as the straight barrels at close and mid range. Acccuracy was noticeably worse at long range and what I'll call 'Flatline range'.

So that got me thinking... Could it be possible Flatlines are only less accurate after a certain range? Could they be more accurate within a certain range? I've never shot a Flatline or Apex so I have no clue if what I saw was the rule or exception. Additionally what about an Apex with slight spin?

Any thoughts? Would it be worth testing?

[nickydp33]

u should def test it out, i love playin woodball with my flatline, should be interesting to see results

[Poe]

nickydp33, on Dec 8 2008, 02:49 PM, said:

u should def test it out, i love playin woodball with my flatline, should be interesting to see results

Do you find it consistently less accurate then a conventional barrel or is the lack (if any) of accuracy more sporadic?

[nickydp33]

Poe, on Dec 8 2008, 03:08 PM, said:

nickydp33, on Dec 8 2008, 02:49 PM, said:

u should def test it out, i love playin woodball with my flatline, should be interesting to see results

Do you find it consistently less accurate then a conventional barrel or is the lack (if any) of accuracy more sporadic?

i dont see a difference in accuracy really. it might be from the fact ive been playing with my a-5 for years now. im sure if i handed it to smoeone else they might feel otherwise. i guess my view is kind of a biased one.

[Lord Odin]

A person's impression of something is usually always skewed. Even if they are aiming at a target, human error can cause fluctuations in data. If you want to find out how accurate it is, setup a grid that can be reused at varying distances. Fire off some shots with the Flatline and with a standard barrel of equal length. Just make sure you secure the gun (even between barrel changes) and only move the target. A good accuracy test would be interesting because I also have heard the Flatline is really inaccurate at longer ranges. I have heard the Apex is better but still not that great. It would be nice to see some actual numbers to back those claims up.

[Poe]

Lord Odin, on Dec 8 2008, 06:18 PM, said:

A person's impression of something is usually always skewed. Even if they are aiming at a target, human error can cause fluctuations in data. If you want to find out how accurate it is, setup a grid that can be reused at varying distances. Fire off some shots with the Flatline and with a standard barrel of equal length. Just make sure you secure the gun (even between barrel changes) and only move the target. A good accuracy test would be interesting because I also have heard the Flatline is really inaccurate at longer ranges. I have heard the Apex is better but still not that great. It would be nice to see some actual numbers to back those claims up.

I suppose that's the point of this post.

Would it be worth testing to determine if the Flatline/Apex is truly less accurate at ALL distances? Would it be worth testing different APEX spin rates to see if it could becomes MORE accurate then a traditional barrel?

Just a thought for a test suggestion down the road.

[Troy]

Poe, on Dec 9 2008, 05:34 PM, said:

I suppose that's the point of this post.

Would it be worth testing to determine if the Flatline/Apex is truly less accurate at ALL distances? Would it be worth testing different APEX spin rates to see if it could becomes MORE accurate then a traditional barrel?

Just a thought for a test suggestion down the road.

I'm willing to bet that just like the backspin bolt it will show that both the flatline and the apex's effect can be greatly amplified or mitigated by any surface deformations. One interesting point though is that the flatline definitely overbores. It would be interesting to see at which distance it's performance is similar to another overbored barrel.

[SLG turtle]

well, yeah wind will definitly mess with the projectory of it. and the fact that paintball guns do not have a very consistant rate, like plus or minius 5 Fps.... will make almost any barrel and any gun innacurate. Also the spectators don't know when the ball is going to slide down while the shooter will.

[Murd0ck]

I have a flatline, and I'll say that bore size is HUGE. A good bore to barrel match is crucial, and in my experience having the gun at about 180fps is the best for it as far as distance. My flatline LOVES Chronic paint, but I can't afford it most of the time so i don't shoot it.

I have noticed that it does appear to lose accuracy at longer ranges, as it will spin in another direction sometimes. Close and midrange is great, but farther distances...meh. It will get there, but I may have to send a little more to actually dot someone. It sort of floats too. Nice flat shot, but not super accurate at range for me, which is ironic because that is why I bought the thing. I have shot over 50 cases through it, at least.

[brycelarson]

Murd0ck, on Dec 16 2008, 08:53 PM, said:

I have a flatline, and I'll say that bore size is HUGE. A good bore to barrel match is crucial, and in my experience having the gun at about 180fps is the best for it as far as distance.

It sort of floats too.

you mean 280 - right?

and yes, I can't count the number of times that I've stepped slowly out of the way of balls from a flatline. I know that it's theoretically possible for someone to break a ball on me from that range - but it sure isn't likely.

[Murd0ck]

brycelarson, on Dec 16 2008, 08:39 PM, said:

Murd0ck, on Dec 16 2008, 08:53 PM, said:

I have a flatline, and I'll say that bore size is HUGE. A good bore to barrel match is crucial, and in my experience having the gun at about 180fps is the best for it as far as distance.

It sort of floats too.

you mean 280 - right?

and yes, I can't count the number of times that I've stepped slowly out of the way of balls from a flatline. I know that it's theoretically possible for someone to break a ball on me from that range - but it sure isn't likely.

haha, yeah i did. You know the bad part? I edited that part because i had "10fps" at first. jesus.

And right again. I don't ever get people out at range when they see me shooting at them. From farther away, I try to shoot peoples exposed bits, or sweetspot them while they run.

[Lord Odin]

I don't own a Flatline but know many people that do. They recommend setting the velocity between 265-275 fps and to use small paint.

Here's an excellent thread about the Flatline barrel:

http://www.a5og.net/flatline-barrel-system...ine-barrel.html

[Troy]

Lord Odin, on Dec 17 2008, 09:44 AM, said:

I don't own a Flatline but know many people that do. They recommend setting the velocity between 265-275 fps and to use small paint.

Here's an excellent thread about the Flatline barrel:

http://www.a5og.net/flatline-barrel-system...ine-barrel.html

Yeah there is definitely a sweet spot for all the barrels where they seem to shoot the best. I've noticed (but have no data to back this up) that my 98's flatline SEEMS to shoot better than my A5's (less breaks). I suspect that this is because the barrel is longer and has a less dramatic bend. That would be an interesting thing to test... unfortunately I don't have my 98 around anymore.

[Poe]

Murd0ck, on Dec 16 2008, 09:53 PM, said:

...
I have noticed that it does appear to lose accuracy at longer ranges, as it will spin in another direction sometimes. Close and midrange is great, but farther distances...meh.
...

Would be interesting to test after the over/under bore accuracy tests. Especially if it proves to be more accurate then a traditional barrel at close to mid range.

Using an Apex for its adjustments might be better for testing purposes though. That way you could use the same gun as previous accuracy tests.

[brycelarson]

Poe, on Dec 17 2008, 01:30 PM, said:

Murd0ck, on Dec 16 2008, 09:53 PM, said:

...
I have noticed that it does appear to lose accuracy at longer ranges, as it will spin in another direction sometimes. Close and midrange is great, but farther distances...meh.
...

Would be interesting to test after the over/under bore accuracy tests. Especially if it proves to be more accurate then a traditional barrel at close to mid range.

Using an Apex for its adjustments might be better for testing purposes though. That way you could use the same gun as previous accuracy tests.

our test is pretty easy to replicate. you simply need a target at the same distance as ours - and a chrono to record shot velocites. We'll be shooting at 50 feet. As long as velocity is recorded for each shot the spread of the impacts at 50 feet will be comparable to our test.

[Cheap-o]

lol, my flatline shot spraight for 10 feet then curved straight up and fell 10 feet from where i was shooting from... thank you tippmann for fucking up your cyclone loaders

[Lord Odin]

Cheap-o, on Dec 20 2008, 12:11 PM, said:

lol, my flatline shot spraight for 10 feet then curved straight up and fell 10 feet from where i was shooting from... thank you tippmann for fucking up your cyclone loaders

How does the Flatline not working correctly translate to the Cyclone messing up?

BTW, I would test both the Flatline and Apex because they accomplish the same task through different methods. It would also serve as a comparison test between the two. You would just have to test the Apex more due to the fact that it has different settings.

[NeCaNeS]

I might suggest that wind, humidity, temperature, and the slope or angle that the ball is going at could affect it. I look forward to seeing some tests.

[madpaintballlover01]

flatlines are not worth the money unless you but mine for $5