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First Strike Field Acceptance


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#1 UV Halo

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Posted 19 October 2010 - 11:48 AM

This thread is for the discussion of 'how' to get these rounds accepted for use at these fields. What this thread is NOT for:

Discussing First Strike rounds (what they are, what markers shoot them, how well they perform, how much they cost, etc).

If you want to get these rounds approved for use on your local field, read on.

In some cases, the sheer numbers of players asking may prompt a field into allowing them. In other cases, the field staff may want more information about the rounds themselves. Some fields need information and a strong enough interest from their customers. This is where we come in. Informed players/customers can make a difference. Not only can we show our enthusiasm and build enthusiasm amongst other players, we can intelligently answer questions that a field operator could have.

I'd like to point out that while these rounds meet the technical ASTM definition/specification of a paintball, I strongly suggest that you do not show up and start using these rounds on a field without getting explicit authorization from the staff beforehand. Additionally, we must not deceive or deny owners of information that may be important to them, or their customers (your fellow players).

Imagine the following scenario: you show up and you start hitting people from further away and the recipients think you are shooting hot, or you hit some bare skin and gave them a minor cut/scratch. They're going to go to the refs/managers and complain. Before too long, the staff will know it is you. Then, the ref/managers will most likely snatch you up and ask to see you chrono your gun. Then, he/she notices you're not shooting a paintball and instead they're some sort of plastic looking projectile they know nothing about (or maybe some player turns in the bits of plastic shell). Now you're forced to defend a product rather than pitch it. This is bad for the sport, bad for the product and bad for the community.

Please understand that for the field you are approaching, this is a business decision. Conducting yourself in a professional manner will help your points come across more effectively.

Before Contacting the Field

Research- If you're pitching these rounds to the field, chances are you're their informal 'subject matter expert' on the rounds. So, you better know your stuff. Things you need to be able to discuss (both the manufacturer's claims and what players are seeing):

What the rounds are specifically (i.e. .68 caliber, photodegradable polystyrene, aerodynamic paint marking projectiles).

The performance (range / speed / fragility / accuracy) of the rounds

How these rounds interact with the human target

Photodegradability of the rounds

Which markers can shoot them out of the box (and how other markers can shoot them)

How these rounds compare to the Less-Lethal FN303 rounds- A lot of folks have heard of them (thanks to the Boston killing) but, most do not know the differences and the negative association may influence a field operator's decision.

Field Paint Only options – Currently the FPO variety is a pale blue. They can, and do, group geographically separated fields together for a custom run of a specific color.

Retail Costs, and units of sale (bulk box, tubes, etc)

Where the staff can go for more information

Some fields may not care about all of this stuff, but it's better to have the information and not be asked than to be asked and to say you don't know or put out some bad info.

Recommend reading / viewing (links will be provided soon):

Tiberius Arms product literature

Users / Reviewers YouTube videos

Lord Odin's Safety Tests

Lord Odin's Degradability Test

Punkworks Drop/Break Test

Punkworks /TechPBMike Performance Tests

FN303 Rounds (so you can be able to explain the difference between FS rounds and the Less Lethal rounds that look similar)

Gathering materials- Try and get a small amount of the rounds for you to show the field (an 8-round tube should be just about enough), print out a list of sites the staff can visit for more information.

Prepare/rehearse your talking points. You need to give this information in a clear and structured manner so that the owner can understand you, and retain what you've said. Preparing and/or rehearsing these points will help you communicate effectively.

Meeting with the staff

This doesn't necessarily need to be formal. Just ask for some of the manager's (or owner's) time to discuss your interest in using the rounds at their field. Personally, I phone ahead to the manager. Remember, you're informing the field owner about the rounds, and you're not acting as a salesman. Keep the conversion factual, and be clear when you are giving your opinion (they are often interested in your opinion as well as the facts).

Be sensitive to the concerns of the staff. Be willing to work with them to reach an agreeable solution. Be prepared for, and offer to do a demo because, some people don't care what they're told, they want to see it for themselves. Expect for them to want to 'sleep on it'. Finally, realize that despite your best efforts, they may still say "No".

After the meeting

Within a week (or longer if they tell you they will be away for trade shows, etc), give them a polite call/email to follow up on the conversation. If they say no, wait a month or two and ask if they've changed their minds.

On the field

Adhere to the policies of the field. Be an ambassador for the rounds to the staff and other players. Make sure the refs are familiar with them (the color, smaller amount of paint, etc). Answer the questions of other players (the only question I don't answer: "How many rounds are in a magazine?" when asked by a member of the opposing team). This is your opportunity to generate interest. Even if you are rejected, there is nothing that says you can't show other players the rounds and point them to additional info. I can't think of a player I've met in the last year that wasn't impressed by their design. One of the fields I approached initially said "No" but has since said "Yes" due to an increasing number or requests. Enthusiasm can be a good thing- the more people ask about it, the more likely the field operator is going to allow them.

Some particular points of interest expressed by fields I approached

Field Paint Only: Seeing as all of the fields here are FPO, this is a key interest. Of the two fields that allow me to use them (a third did before they closed down due to Zoning issues), neither field wants to stock them (cause so few people are asking for them), so they grant users of these rounds special permission to use these rounds after paying a BYOP fee. Another field is considering them but, even if they did stock them, it could pose a problem for their refs, since they rely upon paint color to enforce the FPO policy, and the field color is orange.

20ft rule: One field that has a 20ft rule was concerned by the fact that they slow down negligibly in 20ft. This was addressed when the owner had me shoot him in the back at 15ft. He said it felt like a bounce; the fragility of these rounds work in their favor.

Biodegradability: Not a concern to any of the fields I approached. One field highlighted decades of 10rd tubes, busted pods, 12g CO2s, plastic elbows, etc.

Finally, have you made the pitch for these rounds at a field? If so, share your experiences. If you've gotten them approved, be sure to go here.


Edited by UV Halo, 19 October 2010 - 12:02 PM.


#2 Aulldeath

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Posted 19 October 2010 - 11:50 AM

My field actually sells First Strike Rounds, so they automatically accept them Posted Image .
BTW, it is FPO at the field, so.....Posted Image
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#3 DruidicRifleman

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Posted 19 October 2010 - 03:22 PM

yeah my home field is BYOP and a paint ball is a paint ball.
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#4 DruidicRifleman

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Posted 22 October 2010 - 11:02 PM

One issue is guns.

with tiberious arms Being the only first strike guns with The needed magazine fields arenot going to jump on when it's a single company tacamo and Emprie have guns or mods for First strikes.

those mags are gonna be the first big hurdle
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We Killed Humans FOR WE ARE BORG!!!!! RIP In the great PB field in the sky man YOU will BE MISSED!!

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#5 SIEFKA

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Posted 22 October 2010 - 11:04 PM

I was watching the video with mike at ll3 and those mags. I was wondering how come he didnt just tape them all togather and make it easier?
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#6 DruidicRifleman

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Posted 22 October 2010 - 11:23 PM

He did i thought

Edited by DruidicRifleman, 22 October 2010 - 11:23 PM.

Current Set up SP1 with a Ninja 90/45 and Velocity And always rocking a Nerf sword
back Up A5 72/30 Pure energy JJ custom barrel

We Killed Humans FOR WE ARE BORG!!!!! RIP In the great PB field in the sky man YOU will BE MISSED!!

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#7 Geddon

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Posted 30 October 2010 - 09:08 PM

yeah my home field is BYOP and a paint ball is a paint ball.


You are dead wrong about that.

From a field owner's perspective, (i am, in fact, a field owner) there is alot of differences in paint. Paintballs, like people are not created equally.

Oil-based paints leave nasty film on everything they touch. My field is BYOP, but we require oil-free paint.

As far as first strike goes we allow it because of the small quantity of it being used. You still have to buy it from the field and a case of first strike cost the same as a case of regular paintballs ($60)
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#8 UV Halo

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Posted 01 November 2010 - 10:37 AM

As far as first strike goes we allow it because of the small quantity of it being used. You still have to buy it from the field and a case of first strike cost the same as a case of regular paintballs ($60)


Have you learned from Tiberius Arms whether or not the FS rounds are oil free? I would assume they are because how fast the paint dries out but, not being a materials expert, I could be wrong.

When you say a 'case of first strike' do you mean the 100ct case, or the 192rd (24x8rd tubes) case? I ask because, the 100rd case would be getting an approx. 58% markup over retail. Please understand that I'm not saying you are overpricing them. I've heard of several fields that charge 50% or more of a markup on regular field paint. I'm wondering if you apply a higher markup to First Strike rounds than you do regular paint? If so, what are the reasons behind this? (lower # of shots taken per player? Lower customer demand?, custom color? etc)

As of now, the fields in my area which allow FS rounds have BYOP fees for those that use them. One field charges me $15, another charges me $10. Their business case has been 'not enough people have asked for them, for the fields to stock them'. I often wonder what that threshold is and, whether the extremely long FS shelf life (years) contributes to this decision?

#9 paintballjohn

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Posted 01 November 2010 - 10:48 AM

I think FS rounds are awesome, but I just can not afford to shoot them.
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#10 bigballa

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Posted 01 November 2010 - 12:02 PM

I think FS rounds are awesome, but I just can not afford to shoot them.


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#11 UV Halo

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Posted 01 November 2010 - 12:11 PM

Let's keep this on topic: How can we get them approved for use?

If you want to discuss anything else about them, there are plenty of other threads for that:

Can you guys tell me what 50 cal and first strike rounds are?

3 fs questions

First Strike rounds at Amazon

and the list goes on.



#12 paintballjohn

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Posted 01 November 2010 - 01:57 PM

I think that is the reason why no fields carry them. Some one mentioned it earlier. They are expensive, so not a lot of people use them, so fields aren't going to carry them. Ways to get fields to allow them is to get a higher demand for them.
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#13 UV Halo

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Posted 02 November 2010 - 01:39 PM

... Ways to get fields to allow them is to get a higher demand for them.


Thanks for bringing that up! Do you have any ideas that we players can do to increase demand?

Something I didn't really consider- If your field doesn't allow you to use them due to a lack of 'community' interest, ask the owner if you can work with them to generate interest.

For example, arrange to do demo's for other players or, you can even put on a marksmanship contest: One player borrowing your marker (with a sighted in optic) versus any player using regular paintballs while shooting at a distant target. A small prize to make it somewhat interesting.



#14 Robot85

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Posted 05 November 2010 - 12:45 AM

With the mark up on paint prices up here ($140-$240/case for paintballs) I can't see people wanting to pay for first strikes at FPO fields.

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#15 paintballjohn

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Posted 05 November 2010 - 12:59 AM

I think people find them interesting....I just don't think people believe it is worth it to spend 40 dollars on 100 rounds when you could buy 2000 rounds.
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#16 Tin-Man

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Posted 05 November 2010 - 08:29 AM

My field had there own custom first strike round made... and cannot use them.
This is Due to there insurance company not recognizing them as paint balls.
Not to be a pain in the Arse If anyone knows of a insurance company that will allow them on the field Please PM me.

#17 Scheele

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Posted 05 November 2010 - 09:46 AM

With the mark up on paint prices up here ($140-$240/case for paintballs) I can't see people wanting to pay for first strikes at FPO fields.


At the Tiberius booth at Day of the Dead in London we were selling 100ct. boxes at the canadian retail price of $60. It was a field paint only event.

They are already pretty damn expensive. I don't think we will see them go for any more than $80/100rnds which isn't too bad considering how much some fields sell their paint for.

FS rounds don't lose speed as quickly as a paintball. I've even seen one make it through a helmet at 10 ft. Many fields with a 15 ft. bunker rule don't like that. Locally it's been 280fps for normal paint and 260fps for FS to account for that. Maybe suggest different chrono speeds when you are pitching to a field.
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#18 UV Halo

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Posted 05 November 2010 - 02:54 PM

I think people find them interesting....I just don't think people believe it is worth it to spend 40 dollars on 100 rounds when you could buy 2000 rounds.


I did just that, for the majority of last year. Here's how the cost works out for me: With marballizer paintballs at a semi-auto only walk on field, I go through about 1/2 a case (3/4, on a heavy day). With First Strike rounds, I go through a little less than a box a day. At my 'full auto' field, I easily go through a case of paintballs. With FS rounds at the same field, I shoot two boxes.
A box of marbs costs me $65 (plus tax). Two boxes of FS cost me $74 (plus tax, at the same store). In this past year, my elimination ratio has stayed the same or gotten better and, I have more fun doing it so, they are well worth the $10 difference.
Anyone else's mileage may vary (i.e. do they know how to sight in the marker, and aim? Are they good at staying at the 'longballing' distance? etc).

My field had there own custom first strike round made... and cannot use them.
This is Due to there insurance company not recognizing them as paint balls.
Not to be a pain in the Arse If anyone knows of a insurance company that will allow them on the field Please PM me.


By all means this is the right place to bring this up!! Unfortunately, I don't know about the Insurance side of things. I could easily see a field owner trying to describe them (physically), to their insurance rep and the insurance rep simply saying 'no'. Even though they meet the ASTM standard of a paintball. For the fields I play at, I don't know if they made their own interpretation or, if they cleared it with their insurance. It's such a limited thing in my area (I'm one of four that I know of shooting them in 100mi of me) that it may not have reached that level yet. If I were in your shoes, I would call Eric at Tiberius Arms and ask if they have any input or guidance. I'll bring it up with my local field to see what his thoughts are on the subject. Maybe Geddon on here can give his thoughts as well.


With the mark up on paint prices up here ($140-$240/case for paintballs) I can't see people wanting to pay for first strikes at FPO fields.


At the Tiberius booth at Day of the Dead in London we were selling 100ct. boxes at the canadian retail price of $60. It was a field paint only event.

They are already pretty damn expensive. I don't think we will see them go for any more than $80/100rnds which isn't too bad considering how much some fields sell their paint for.

FS rounds don't lose speed as quickly as a paintball. I've even seen one make it through a helmet at 10 ft. Many fields with a 15 ft. bunker rule don't like that. Locally it's been 280fps for normal paint and 260fps for FS to account for that. Maybe suggest different chrono speeds when you are pitching to a field.


Very true about pricing. Yeah, at 10ft, they are effectively moving at their chrono speed. I don't know the specifics of what you witnessed but, I'd bet that against that same helmet (assuming a JT headshield type), a paintball at point blank (at the same FPS) would do the same or worse.

#19 Scheele

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Posted 05 November 2010 - 03:31 PM


I think people find them interesting....I just don't think people believe it is worth it to spend 40 dollars on 100 rounds when you could buy 2000 rounds.


I did just that, for the majority of last year. Here's how the cost works out for me: With marballizer paintballs at a semi-auto only walk on field, I go through about 1/2 a case (3/4, on a heavy day). With First Strike rounds, I go through a little less than a box a day. At my 'full auto' field, I easily go through a case of paintballs. With FS rounds at the same field, I shoot two boxes.
A box of marbs costs me $65 (plus tax). Two boxes of FS cost me $74 (plus tax, at the same store). In this past year, my elimination ratio has stayed the same or gotten better and, I have more fun doing it so, they are well worth the $10 difference.
Anyone else's mileage may vary (i.e. do they know how to sight in the marker, and aim? Are they good at staying at the 'longballing' distance? etc).

My field had there own custom first strike round made... and cannot use them.
This is Due to there insurance company not recognizing them as paint balls.
Not to be a pain in the Arse If anyone knows of a insurance company that will allow them on the field Please PM me.


By all means this is the right place to bring this up!! Unfortunately, I don't know about the Insurance side of things. I could easily see a field owner trying to describe them (physically), to their insurance rep and the insurance rep simply saying 'no'. Even though they meet the ASTM standard of a paintball. For the fields I play at, I don't know if they made their own interpretation or, if they cleared it with their insurance. It's such a limited thing in my area (I'm one of four that I know of shooting them in 100mi of me) that it may not have reached that level yet. If I were in your shoes, I would call Eric at Tiberius Arms and ask if they have any input or guidance. I'll bring it up with my local field to see what his thoughts are on the subject. Maybe Geddon on here can give his thoughts as well.


With the mark up on paint prices up here ($140-$240/case for paintballs) I can't see people wanting to pay for first strikes at FPO fields.


At the Tiberius booth at Day of the Dead in London we were selling 100ct. boxes at the canadian retail price of $60. It was a field paint only event.

They are already pretty damn expensive. I don't think we will see them go for any more than $80/100rnds which isn't too bad considering how much some fields sell their paint for.

FS rounds don't lose speed as quickly as a paintball. I've even seen one make it through a helmet at 10 ft. Many fields with a 15 ft. bunker rule don't like that. Locally it's been 280fps for normal paint and 260fps for FS to account for that. Maybe suggest different chrono speeds when you are pitching to a field.


Very true about pricing. Yeah, at 10ft, they are effectively moving at their chrono speed. I don't know the specifics of what you witnessed but, I'd bet that against that same helmet (assuming a JT headshield type), a paintball at point blank (at the same FPS) would do the same or worse.


It was a mock military helmet. It was some sort of ceramic material and that gun was shooting around 280-290 at the time, hence the 260fps rule.

The thing with fields in Canada is that most are set up for rental groups. That have a higher markup because they go through much less paint. That being the way it is, we will only see the FS rounds being shot by experienced players so expect small, if any, field markup.

FS rounds are mostly white fill which is another benefit to fields. White is non-staining and cleans up easy. Many BYOP fields only allow white fill paint to be shot.

I'd be really surprised if there where any fields that refuse FS rounds on their fields. FPO fields maybe since people shoot less and there is a smaller margin than their regular paint. BYOP fields have little reason to keep their fields FS free.
IMO, any respectable field worth giving your week's pay to should already have all the info and have FS rounds on their field.
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