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The effect of petroleum based lubricants on O rings


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#1 JJ GBR

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Posted 17 February 2009 - 11:51 AM

Here's one for you Punkworks.

I keep being told that i should never use anything petroleum based to lubricate my O rings, because it will damage them and render the seal ineffective.

But i've been using some stuff called 'napier gun oil' on my tippmann for a while now, and it's running just fine (i'm not sure if the oil contains/is based from petroleum, it doesn't say on the can or website), so i was wondering which lubricants do effect/damage O rings (and to what extent)?

From what i've gathered from my Dad (electrical engineer), O rings are fairly inert, so is it just scare mongering about petroleum based lubricants and O rings? Or is it true that some lubricants will damage them?

Edited by JJ GBR, 17 February 2009 - 01:25 PM.


#2 Maj Tom

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Posted 17 February 2009 - 12:37 PM

I'ts not really petroleum based lubes that are problem-some. But lubes that contain petroleum distillates(basically your popular solvents: denatured alcohol, Naptha, mineral spirits) and detergents. These generate some slow reactions with the o-rings both preferable and unwanted.
Edit: Bad sentence structure

Edited by Maj Tom, 17 February 2009 - 05:29 PM.


#3 FulniX

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Posted 17 February 2009 - 05:25 PM

Maj Tom,
You are correct, depending on what is in the lube you use it could either swell or cause the o-ring to break down. Stick to the synthetic stuff and you won't have issues. Air tool oil will work if you can't find any paintball gun oil. You might not notice the damage immediately but over time you will see the effects. As for grease like DOW stick to DOW 33 based greases for any moving o-ring this will ensure the o-ring doesn't swell and change the operating tolerances of your marker. You can use DOW 55 but be very careful to use it on only static non moving o-rings, DOW 55 was designed to cause a slight swelling to O-rings to create a better seal, if you put this on a moving o-ring, depending on the tolerances of the marker you could run into some problems. Most paintball gun grease on the market is based on some form of DOW 33. Hope that helped.
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#4 Christopher

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Posted 17 February 2009 - 06:23 PM

Whenever I don't have "real lube", I just use Vaseline. It does not preform quite as well (as it is thicker), but I have not noticed any damage. While I don't recommend using Vaseline if you have other options, it's not a horrible substitute.

Air tool oil will not cause damage to your O-rings. That should be a no brainer.

#5 GrenadeMaster

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 10:25 PM

Vaseline is what is actually recommended in the etek 2 manual if I recall.
There's two kinds of people in this world when you boil it all down. You got your talkers and you got your doers. Most people are just talkers, all they do is talk. But when it is all said and done, it's the doers that change this world. And when they do that, they change us, and that's why we never forget them. So which one are you? Do you just talk about it, or do you stand up and do something about it?

#6 crusificton

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 11:11 PM

Planet Eclipse recommended Vaseline before re-releasing their grease that came with the Geo.

#7 FulniX

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 12:55 AM

Vaseline may work in a pinch but I would stay away from it, you gun will perform much better with either a 100% synthetic oil or a dow 33 based lube depending on the type of marker you have.
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#8 wgp2002

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 01:00 AM

autocockers used to reccomend it and it worked fine (vaseline) only problem is if it got any dirt in it it stuck in the vaseline
The lesson here is love your gun dont give a shit about what people say about it.. if it fits you keep it if not move on. I get enough crap from kids who think autocockers are shit when most have never shot one. Every angel I ever shot was smooth but they were out of my range so i went with an autococker instead. Now I have a couple and they are my babies. Love the sport Love your gun whatever it may be and Love yourself .. maybe not in that order. CockerOwnerClub

#9 GrenadeMaster

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 04:07 PM

Vaseline may work in a pinch but I would stay away from it, you gun will perform much better with either a 100% synthetic oil or a dow 33 based lube depending on the type of marker you have.


I like it better then dow 33. Dow 33 is about +-5 fps worse then what I get with Vaseline. Dow 55 is about equal.
There's two kinds of people in this world when you boil it all down. You got your talkers and you got your doers. Most people are just talkers, all they do is talk. But when it is all said and done, it's the doers that change this world. And when they do that, they change us, and that's why we never forget them. So which one are you? Do you just talk about it, or do you stand up and do something about it?

#10 Christopher

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 05:59 PM

Vaseline may work in a pinch but I would stay away from it, you gun will perform much better with either a 100% synthetic oil or a dow 33 based lube depending on the type of marker you have.


I like it better then dow 33. Dow 33 is about +-5 fps worse then what I get with Vaseline. Dow 55 is about equal.


Wow, that's very interesting. What gun?

#11 GrenadeMaster

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:54 PM

My etek 2.

I took it for granted that it was understood I was only using it on the LPR and HPR. NOT the rammer. Also, I only use a very light coat, but I do very regular maintenance on my guns. Once a week, if I play or not. And I do a complete rip down very month, meaning I go down to each individual part.



My guns always perform like beast, and I have only ever had ONE problem with my guns in 6 years or so.

That was a bad day, I didn't take a back-up gun, and my gun went down... and I had people lend me guns to use for the day... I went through 7 guns that day all of which had a problem, finally gave up said "Screw it" and played with a box of 40 grenades I had with me instead of a marker. It was funny because 2 of the guns people went and tested out the gun they were lending me, with me standing right there, the shot maybe 150 rounds threw them said, "here yah go its shooting fine" and as soon as they handed it to me the autococker had a house blow that we couldn't fix, and the A-5 snapped the drive spring on the first shot after I pulled the trigger.
There's two kinds of people in this world when you boil it all down. You got your talkers and you got your doers. Most people are just talkers, all they do is talk. But when it is all said and done, it's the doers that change this world. And when they do that, they change us, and that's why we never forget them. So which one are you? Do you just talk about it, or do you stand up and do something about it?

#12 cockerpunk

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 07:14 PM

so - whos gonna test it?

seems like an easy one ...

Edited by cockerpunk, 19 February 2009 - 07:20 PM.

The ultimate truth in paintball is that the interaction between the gun and the player is far and away the largest factor in accuracy, consistency, and reliability.

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#13 Mockstar

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 07:18 PM

So you want me to leave my orings in a jar of Unleaded for a week?

#14 cockerpunk

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 07:21 PM

So you want me to leave my orings in a jar of Unleaded for a week?


or Vaseline ...
The ultimate truth in paintball is that the interaction between the gun and the player is far and away the largest factor in accuracy, consistency, and reliability.

And yes, Gordon is the sexiest manifestation of "to the front."


#15 theCanadian

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 10:04 PM

One thing I think would be tough about this test, is how do you analyze the damage done to the o-rings. I really don't see visual inspection telling the whole story.
Maybe compare gun performance (consistency? efficiency?) with control batch rings, compared to variable batch rings?
Also you would have to define what "damage" actually means in this situation. Its certainly more complicated than it seems...
Just my 2 cents.

Edited by theCanadian, 19 February 2009 - 10:07 PM.

SP1


#16 cockerpunk

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 10:24 PM

if it does the damage people claim it does, i think you can visually check them, followed by a test in the gun to make sure they seal.
The ultimate truth in paintball is that the interaction between the gun and the player is far and away the largest factor in accuracy, consistency, and reliability.

And yes, Gordon is the sexiest manifestation of "to the front."


#17 Leftystrikesback

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 10:30 PM

I've always heard that WD-40 would be very bad to lube your gun with, to satisfy my own curiosity I sprayed some WD-40 on neoprene O-rings and let it sit for a while. After about a week I forgot about it and I think it got thrown out, but up until then I couldn't feel or see any difference. My guess is that if petroleum based lubes are bad for O-rings then it really takes a long time for anything to happen.
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#18 FulniX

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 03:38 AM

My etek 2.

I took it for granted that it was understood I was only using it on the LPR and HPR. NOT the rammer. Also, I only use a very light coat, but I do very regular maintenance on my guns. Once a week, if I play or not. And I do a complete rip down very month, meaning I go down to each individual part.



My guns always perform like beast, and I have only ever had ONE problem with my guns in 6 years or so.

That was a bad day, I didn't take a back-up gun, and my gun went down... and I had people lend me guns to use for the day... I went through 7 guns that day all of which had a problem, finally gave up said "Screw it" and played with a box of 40 grenades I had with me instead of a marker. It was funny because 2 of the guns people went and tested out the gun they were lending me, with me standing right there, the shot maybe 150 rounds threw them said, "here yah go its shooting fine" and as soon as they handed it to me the autococker had a house blow that we couldn't fix, and the A-5 snapped the drive spring on the first shot after I pulled the trigger.


GrenadeMaster,
Your HPR and LPR have enough pressure and spring tension so that even a sticky lube will work. On many regulators using a more viscous lube may be better due to the pressures involved and the lack of movement. Check out a lube called Parker Super Lube, very sticky but it's awesome on tank reg's


I've always heard that WD-40 would be very bad to lube your gun with, to satisfy my own curiosity I sprayed some WD-40 on neoprene O-rings and let it sit for a while. After about a week I forgot about it and I think it got thrown out, but up until then I couldn't feel or see any difference. My guess is that if petroleum based lubes are bad for O-rings then it really takes a long time for anything to happen.


Leftystrikesback,
Yes WD-40 and others like it Tri-flow are very bad for o-rings and will cause them to swell at first and then eventully break down. It makes me cringe every time Mike puts Tri-flow on his ASA threads, Mike please use some 100% synthetic oil or Dow, it will do the same thing and not hurt your gun on the off chance it gets in it. Truth be told your gun is probably fine as you don't hose it down with the stuff. The worst lube I have ever seen for O-rings is some very nasty stuff called PB Blaster, WARNING if you use this make sure you have lots of air flow or you'll get high/a wicked head ach.
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#19 Maj Tom

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 06:52 AM

if it does the damage people claim it does, i think you can visually check them, followed by a test in the gun to make sure they seal.

I did a quick test a few years ago on "alternate" lubes (only did a small cross section of fluid type lubricants) and let them sit in the respective fluid for a week.
[attachment=1420:IMG_1947.JPG]
[attachment=1419:graph.JPG]
It was more f a test to determine if alternate lubes effected the size of the rings.

#20 cockerpunk

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 12:54 PM

great work tom, thats exactly what i was thinking.
The ultimate truth in paintball is that the interaction between the gun and the player is far and away the largest factor in accuracy, consistency, and reliability.

And yes, Gordon is the sexiest manifestation of "to the front."


#21 CrazyLittle

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 01:55 PM

But hey, if you want colored o-rings now we know you can dye UR orings with power steering fluid.

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#22 MrNelspot007

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Posted 26 June 2012 - 07:56 PM

I realize this is an old thread and I am hesitant to admit this but here goes it... I have used Vaseline (petroleum jelly) on my Tippmann A-5 bolt and hammer. Not a good idea for those running Co2... turned into a opaque white glue-like paste. That can't be good. I wiped that crap off and never used petrol products on any paintball marker since.

At the time when I used the petroleum jelly I can remember that it was cold out (40 degrees F) and I was firing quite rapidly (rapidly firing Co2 at low temps causes marker internals to get very cold & even form frost). So I can draw two conclusions from the use of petroleum jelly in a Co2 paintball marker... either petroleum jelly does not work at cold temperatures or the Co2 reacted in a bad way with it.

I highly recommend NOT using petroleum jelly (such as Vaseline) in any Co2 operated marker - probably not any marker - ever.

Mineral oil (also a petrol product) could be possibly used as an inexpensive paintball lubricant. Most often, mineral oil is a liquid by-product of the distillation of petroleum to produce gasoline and other petroleum-based products from crude oil. A mineral oil in this sense is a transparent, colorless oil composed mainly of alkanes and cyclic paraffins, related to petroleum jelly (also known as "white petrolatum"). It has a density of around 0.8 g/cm3. Mineral oil is a substance of relatively low value, and it is produced in very large quantities. Mineral oil is available in light and heavy grades, and can often be found in drug stores. Id be curious to see the results of using mineral oil or a mix of mineral oil + DOW 33 grease (DOW 33 for added viscosity) for use on moving o-rings of paintball markers.

Air tool oils are another to consider... although slightly more expensive than mineral oil, air tool oil is still less expensive than most paintball specific lubricants. It is usually transparent like mineral oil but it may also more appropriate to use for paintball than mineral oil. I have heard rumor that Slick Honey, which is a paintball lube formulated for spool valve markers, is made up of a mix of DOW 33 and air tool oil. I just don't know the specific ratio of the Slick Honey mix or I'd use it myself.

One thing to note about petroleum products on paintball applications: DO NOT USE PETROL PRODUCTS IN HIGH PRESSURE REGULATORS OR ON FILL NIPPLE O-RINGS. This will cause combustion (aka flame or explosion) = not cool. Mike has covered this as well in a couple of his videos if you don't want to take my word for it. Use 100% synthetic grease or silicone grease on tank regulators and fill nipple o-rings such as Tri-Flow Synthetic Grease or Guerrilla Air Chemplex.

Edited by MrNelspot007, 26 June 2012 - 09:35 PM.

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#23 Jaccen

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 12:57 AM

Good ol' ATF works wonders, too. It was recommended in my Stingray manual. Allegedly, AKA's lube was non-dyed ATF.

#24 elraido

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 09:24 AM

I don't understand why people just don't spend $1-$2 and just get this.... http://www.paintball...l-MTOIL-0X.aspx http://www.iisports....A&dept_id=12347 Or go crazy and spend $13 and get this http://www.paintball...MTTTGDO-0X.aspx

#25 Troy

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 11:05 AM

I don't understand why people just don't spend $1-$2 and just get this.... http://www.paintball...l-MTOIL-0X.aspx http://www.iisports....A&dept_id=12347 Or go crazy and spend $13 and get this http://www.paintball...MTTTGDO-0X.aspx


I agree. You guys play paintball right? Get some paintball lube!
\m/

#26 cockerpunk

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 01:41 PM

someone should really test this. buy all the lubes, toss some orings in, and see what happens.
The ultimate truth in paintball is that the interaction between the gun and the player is far and away the largest factor in accuracy, consistency, and reliability.

And yes, Gordon is the sexiest manifestation of "to the front."


#27 TK-421

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 02:04 PM

someone should really test this. buy all the lubes, toss some orings in, and see what happens.


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#28 elraido

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 02:22 PM

someone should really test this. buy all the lubes, toss some orings in, and see what happens.


I will get the KY.

#29 UV Halo

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 07:50 PM

All this talk and nobody even mentions the types of o-ring material and what o-ring manufacturers say they are good for?

Take a look at this page.

The two types of o-rings I see most often in paintball guns:

Buna-Nitrile

Recommended for: Silicone Greases / Oils, Water, Petroleum Oils / Fuels, Ethylene Glycol Fluids
Not Recommended for: Ketones (MEK), Halogenated Hydrocarbons, Auto / Aircraft Brake Fluids, Strong Acids, Sunlight, Ozone, Weathering


Urethane

Recommended for: Drive Belts, Some Petroleum Oils, Some Hydrocarbon Fuels, Oxygen / Ozone
Not Recommended for: Ketones (MEK), Acids, Auto / Aircraft Brake Fluids, Chlorinated Hydrocarbons, Water


Vaseline (aka petroleum jelly) is a hydrocarbon that's neither halogenated or chlorinated so, I would assume it's fine.

#30 Jaccen

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 10:12 AM

I don't understand why people just don't spend $1-$2 and just get this.... http://www.paintball...l-MTOIL-0X.aspx http://www.iisports....A&dept_id=12347 Or go crazy and spend $13 and get this http://www.paintball...MTTTGDO-0X.aspx


Synthetic air tool oil and ATF are much cheaper and perform competitively :shrug:

Lordin Odin testing air tool oil:
http://www.techpb.co...38

I use either Molykote 33 for those that call for Dow 33 or a combo of the above on ones that need an oil based lubricant.


As for Vaseline, Shocktech recommended that for its 3-way and its o-rings:
http://www.shocktech...faq_mrkr_ac.htm

What should I use to lubricate the Bomb 3-Way O-Rings?
Shocktech recommends using vaseline to lube these O-Rings.


Those lil' things always were pain to buy for me. Such a tiny o-ring.

#31 elraido

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 02:35 PM


I don't understand why people just don't spend $1-$2 and just get this.... http://www.paintball...l-MTOIL-0X.aspx http://www.iisports....A&dept_id=12347 Or go crazy and spend $13 and get this http://www.paintball...MTTTGDO-0X.aspx


Synthetic air tool oil and ATF are much cheaper and perform competitively :shrug:

Lordin Odin testing air tool oil:
http://www.techpb.co...38

I use either Molykote 33 for those that call for Dow 33 or a combo of the above on ones that need an oil based lubricant.


As for Vaseline, Shocktech recommended that for its 3-way and its o-rings:
http://www.shocktech...faq_mrkr_ac.htm

What should I use to lubricate the Bomb 3-Way O-Rings?
Shocktech recommends using vaseline to lube these O-Rings.


Those lil' things always were pain to buy for me. Such a tiny o-ring.


How much oil are you going threw that a $2 1oz bottle isn't enough for you for a while? I am sure that something like this works just fine...http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=83&pcid=27 but do you really need 8 oz?

Edited by elraido, 28 June 2012 - 02:35 PM.


#32 Blade of grass

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 06:53 PM

If you can tell me a place where I can buy cheap O-rings, I would gladly do this experiment.

all my legos are stored at my parents hose... so that wont be happening....

48fhih.png

#33 Troy

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 07:21 PM

McMaster-Carr how does 100 for $2 sound?
\m/

#34 Blade of grass

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 09:30 PM

McMaster-Carr how does 100 for $2 sound?

lol, how much is shipping?

all my legos are stored at my parents hose... so that wont be happening....

48fhih.png

#35 Jaccen

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 09:50 PM



I don't understand why people just don't spend $1-$2 and just get this.... http://www.paintball...l-MTOIL-0X.aspx http://www.iisports....A&dept_id=12347 Or go crazy and spend $13 and get this http://www.paintball...MTTTGDO-0X.aspx


Synthetic air tool oil and ATF are much cheaper and perform competitively :shrug:

Lordin Odin testing air tool oil:
http://www.techpb.co...38

I use either Molykote 33 for those that call for Dow 33 or a combo of the above on ones that need an oil based lubricant.


As for Vaseline, Shocktech recommended that for its 3-way and its o-rings:
http://www.shocktech...faq_mrkr_ac.htm

What should I use to lubricate the Bomb 3-Way O-Rings?
Shocktech recommends using vaseline to lube these O-Rings.


Those lil' things always were pain to buy for me. Such a tiny o-ring.


How much oil are you going threw that a $2 1oz bottle isn't enough for you for a while? I am sure that something like this works just fine...http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=83&pcid=27 but do you really need 8 oz?


I oil up the markers we use for "walk-ons" at our rec field. I have approximately 20 Stingrays, Spyders, and other low-ends in my basement that we use for get togethers. We don't always use them all, but they're there for when we do. Remove the barrel at the end of the day, 2-3 drops in the ASA, 20 or so dry fires and the marker's good for the next time. I'm not breaking down and doing a meticulous clean on a bunch of markers that people often mistake for hatchets.

When it comes to oil/lube, we sometimes buy a bottle/container and split it. Molykote 33 is cheaper at the bearing store rather than the paintball store in my area. $4 for a quart of ATF is better than $2 / 1oz by my math, but my old eyes are getting fuzzy nowadays. I find it interesting that 2 out of your 3 links are to a small bottle of a red, low-friction oil. Food for thought.

The extra ATF I don't use for paintball markers will go in my brother's old Intrepid as it has a small leak. Again, to each their own.

#36 elraido

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 09:05 AM




I don't understand why people just don't spend $1-$2 and just get this.... http://www.paintball...l-MTOIL-0X.aspx http://www.iisports....A&dept_id=12347 Or go crazy and spend $13 and get this http://www.paintball...MTTTGDO-0X.aspx


Synthetic air tool oil and ATF are much cheaper and perform competitively :shrug:

Lordin Odin testing air tool oil:
http://www.techpb.co...38

I use either Molykote 33 for those that call for Dow 33 or a combo of the above on ones that need an oil based lubricant.


As for Vaseline, Shocktech recommended that for its 3-way and its o-rings:
http://www.shocktech...faq_mrkr_ac.htm

What should I use to lubricate the Bomb 3-Way O-Rings?
Shocktech recommends using vaseline to lube these O-Rings.


Those lil' things always were pain to buy for me. Such a tiny o-ring.


How much oil are you going threw that a $2 1oz bottle isn't enough for you for a while? I am sure that something like this works just fine...http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=83&pcid=27 but do you really need 8 oz?


I oil up the markers we use for "walk-ons" at our rec field. I have approximately 20 Stingrays, Spyders, and other low-ends in my basement that we use for get togethers. We don't always use them all, but they're there for when we do. Remove the barrel at the end of the day, 2-3 drops in the ASA, 20 or so dry fires and the marker's good for the next time. I'm not breaking down and doing a meticulous clean on a bunch of markers that people often mistake for hatchets.

When it comes to oil/lube, we sometimes buy a bottle/container and split it. Molykote 33 is cheaper at the bearing store rather than the paintball store in my area. $4 for a quart of ATF is better than $2 / 1oz by my math, but my old eyes are getting fuzzy nowadays. I find it interesting that 2 out of your 3 links are to a small bottle of a red, low-friction oil. Food for thought.

The extra ATF I don't use for paintball markers will go in my brother's old Intrepid as it has a small leak. Again, to each their own.


We are in the same boat. We have over well 20 sypders, 4 VM68's, 4-5 Automags, 4 Autocockers, several pirhanas, an AT-10, a few sting rays and numerous other guns that we let people use when we play. Over the years, we have a collection of 6-8 of those bottles.....and we aren't even close to have using it all. And we do break the guns down and lube up the orings after we are done playing.

#37 Jaccen

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 11:26 AM

We are in the same boat. We have over well 20 sypders, 4 VM68's, 4-5 Automags, 4 Autocockers, several pirhanas, an AT-10, a few sting rays and numerous other guns that we let people use when we play. Over the years, we have a collection of 6-8 of those bottles.....and we aren't even close to have using it all. And we do break the guns down and lube up the orings after we are done playing.


Use whatever works for ya. For me, the Walmart is down the street so I don't pay shipping, the oils are cheap, and I've never seen a difference between "paintball" oils and that listed above. I also dual use my oils (ie. cars, tools, etc.) to maximize what I get out of them. To each their own.

As to shipping for McMaster-Carr, this thread may be of interest:

depends on where you live, they ship UPS Ground out of New Jersey
since I'm in nyc I get the stuff usually next day or second day and its usually really cheap. It depends on where you are and weight

http://www.overclock.net/t/344806/mcmaster-carr-shipping

For shipping o-rings to continental USA, I can't see it being more than $4. That's a high estimate, too. If you want a better guess-timate, I'd try the UPS shipping cost estimator.

Edited by Jaccen, 29 June 2012 - 11:26 AM.


#38 Danny D

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 03:41 PM

You shouldnt use atf, that stuff eats carbon. I use it to lube my firearms.

I had a brand new pure energy reg, and out of the box it wasnt working. After taking the fucker apart, The orings were falling apart in my hands. Degraded to the fifth degree. Urithane o-rings mind you.

Now pure energy at the time of purchase was amalgamated into Empire, so whatever lube PE used took a while to take effect. Based on the packaging, about 2 years. Not saying the o-rings took that long to degrade, but has the potential of being that long. Just a little tidbit of info.

#39 Jaccen

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 09:54 PM

I haven't seen any detrimental effects. From what I've read, admittedly little, I don't see any reason to worry in regards to o-rings.


Buna-N (Nitrile) is suitable for dynamic and static seal of o-rings in the environment containing the following chemicals: Acetamide, Acetic Anhydride, Acetylene Gas, Air below 200 C, Aluminium Chloride, Aluminium Flouride, Aluminium Nitrate, Aluminium Sulfate, Cold Gas Ammonia, Ammonium Nitrate, Ammonium Persulfate Solution, Ammonium Sulfate, Animal Oil, Argon, ASTM Fuel A, ASTM Oil One, ASTM Oil Three, ASTM Oil Two, Automatic Transmission Fluid, Beer, Benzine (Ligroin), Boric Acid, Bunker Oil, Butane, Butter, Butyl Alcohol, Calcium Carbonate, Calcium Chloride, Calcium Hydroxide, Calcium Nitrate, Calcium Sulfide, Carbon Monoxide, Castor Oil, Tung Oil China Wood Oil, Citric Acid, Cod Liver Oil, Coffee, Coolanol Monsanto, Corn Oil, Cyclohexane, Denatured Alcohol, Diesel Oil, Diethylamine Glycol, Dow Corning 550, Dow Guard, Elco 28 Lubricant, Ethane, Ethanol, Ethyl Alcohol, Ethyl Chloride, Ethyl Hexanol, Ethyl Silicate, Ethylene, Ethylene Glycol, Formaldehyde, Freon 113, Freon 114, Freon 12, Freon 13, Freon 32, Freon C318, Freon TF, Fuel Oil, Automotive Gasoline, Gelatine, Glucose, Glycerin, General Glycol, Petroleum Base Grease, Helium, Heptane, Hexane, Petroleum Base Hydraulic Oil, Hydrogen Gas, Iso Octane, Isopropanol, JP 3 MIL-J5624, JP 4 MIL-J5624, JP 5 MIL-J5624, JP 6 MIL-J5624, Kerosene, Animal Fat Lard, Linsed Oil, Liquefied Petroleum Gas (LPG), Petroleum Base Lubricating Oils, Mercuric Chloride, Mercury, Methane, Methyl Alcohol, Methyl Ether, MIL-F-25558 (RJ-1), MIL-F-25656, MIL-H-5606, MIL-H-7083, JP-5 JP-4 JP-3 MIL-J 5624, Milk, MIL-R-25576 (RP-1), Type 1 Fuel MIL-S-3136, MIL-S-81087, Mineral Oils, Naphtha, Natural Gas, Neatsfoot Oil, Gas Nitrogen, N-Pentane, Oleic Acid, Peanut Oil, Petroleum Oil, Potassium Nitrate, Potassium Sulfate, Producer Gas, Propane, Propanol, Propyl Alcohol, Transformer Oil Pyranol, Red Oil, RJ-1 (MIL-F-25558), RP-1 (MIL-R-25576), Sea Water, Silicone Grease, Silicone Oils, Sodium Bicarbonate, Sodium Carbonate, Sodium Chloride, Sodium Hydroxide, Soyabean Oil, Stearic Acid, Stoddard Solvent, Sucrose Solutions, Tannic Acid, Tartaric Acid, Type A Transmission Fluid, Turpentine, Fresh Water, Whiskey.

http://www.efunda.co...n_(nitrile).cfm

Common O-Ring materials that are SUITABLE for dynamic and static seal in the environment containing Automatic Transmission Fluid include:

Buna-N (Nitrile): Buna-N, also known as Nitrile rubber, is a synthetic rubber copolymer of acrylonitrile (ACN) and butadiene.


ASSUMPTION: By Millable Polyurethane, they mean common urethane o-rings. This ranking of material is supported by the chart below this webpage. However, I very likely could be wrong. Please feel free to correct.

The O-Ring materials below are USUALLY SUITABLE for static seal in the environment containing Automatic Transmission Fluid.

Millable Polyurethane: Millable Polyurethane rubber is made from both polyester and polyether polyols.

http://www.efunda.com/glossary/design/oring/design--oring--chemical--automatic_transmission_fluid.cfm


In regards to automatic transmission fluid, they rank Nitriles as "compatible" and urethanes as "minor incompatibility." That's the same as what they rank lubricating oils, petroleum-based. Transmission Fluid Type A is ranked "compatible" for both. Same as mineral oil which I've used in a pinch.
http://cmrubber.thom...ility-Chart.pdf


I don't know the exact composition of "paintball oils" so researching their properties usually leads to a bunch of marketing claims. I'm open to reading up on actual data if there are links I'm unaware of.

However, I also need to admit that I have no actual data to show. So I propose this. I will test o-rings in ATF, mineral oil, synthetic air tool oil, and Gold Cup Gun Oil. It seems to be about the cheapest of the paintball oils so I could stomach buying a few oz. of it. I'll use these o-rings as they would be common ones paintballers use:

Buna

Urethane

Tests I can think of:

1. Thickness of O-ring (ie. digital calipers)
2. Load weight before shear (ie. hang one from a nail and load it up with fishing weights until it snaps)
3. Compression test (ie. how many twists in a clamp for a simple elastic/plastic test)
4. Tests above a different temperatures (ie. colder)
5. Test above over time (ie. a month or more between tests)

Any other tests anyone can think of? What sample size would you guys be happy with?

#40 madsnipes

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 09:18 PM

Vaseline is what is actually recommended in the etek 2 manual if I recall.

i think its also recomended for the creed

#41 Egomaniacal

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 12:24 AM

I use either Molykote 33 for those that call for Dow 33 or a combo of the above on ones that need an oil based lubricant.


Dow 33 and Molykote 33 are the same thing.
eiπ = − 1

#42 Jaccen

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 09:25 PM


I use either Molykote 33 for those that call for Dow 33 or a combo of the above on ones that need an oil based lubricant.


Dow 33 and Molykote 33 are the same thing.


Yup.

Dow 33 specs:
http://modoc.com/dow...ing/data/33.pdf

Molykote 33 specs:
http://www.idl.ku.ed...MolyKote 33.pdf

The typical properties charts are the same.

The bearing stores around London only seem to stock Molykote 33. I just presumed it was a Kleenix vs. facial tissue (ie. name marketing) thing. Though, since Molykote was a Dow brand, I never really got why they did it. Dunno if it's the whole "Toyota vs. Lexus" thing or just Dow finding a purpose for their marketing department. *shrug* I just look for Molykote 33 or 55 when it calls for Dow in the manual. "Molykote" just seems to be easier and cheaper to find for me in my location.

#43 Collby

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 05:14 PM

is planet eclipse lube ok to use?

#44 Blade of grass

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 07:50 AM

is planet eclipse lube ok to use?

Ok, think about that for a bit, would PE lube, a paintball specific lube, would it work?

all my legos are stored at my parents hose... so that wont be happening....

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