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Rifled barrels?


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#1 tallsmallboy44

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 10:28 PM

Theoretically speaking shouldnt a rifled paintball barrel increase accuracy. This makes sense to me because back in the 1700s muskets had awful accuracy with the minie ball. As soon as rifling was introduced, accuracy was greatly increased with the minie ball. I feel like the same concept would apply with paintballs, as both the paintball and minie ball are round projectiles.

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#2 kingJurzy

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 10:30 PM

Spoiler


The riffling can cut the paintball, and it allows air to travel around it.

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#3 tallsmallboy44

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 10:33 PM

Spoiler


The riffling can cut the paintball, and it allows air to travel around it.

Makes sense. What if monster balls where used?

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#4 kingJurzy

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 10:35 PM


Spoiler


The riffling can cut the paintball, and it allows air to travel around it.

Makes sense. What if monster balls where used?


dunno, they might have a lower chance of breaking, but no spin.

Try to mod a barrel to have FS round riffling.

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#5 brycelarson

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Posted 26 July 2012 - 11:50 AM

We saw no difference in accuracy in our testing between a rifled barrel and a standard barrel. Most rifled barrels are large - so they don't really interact with the paintball the same way that a rifled barrel does with a lead bullet.

#6 pb=life

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Posted 26 July 2012 - 08:18 PM

We saw no difference in accuracy in our testing between a rifled barrel and a standard barrel. Most rifled barrels are large - so they don't really interact with the paintball the same way that a rifled barrel does with a lead bullet.

If you were to get a rifled barrel that was bore matched would you see an accuracy gain? What about if you're using reballs?

#7 bigx

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Posted 26 July 2012 - 11:59 PM

Take everything you know about firearm ballistics and throw it out the window, Paintballs are essentially smaller harder water balloons. There is no way to ensure perfect uniformity between each projectile and there are too many inconsistencies and variables to contend with. The reason why Rifling with firearms works because the projectiles all hit the rifling the same way conform to the groves inside the barrel and get the ideal amount of rotational force for it to "spiral" like a football until it hits the target.

Paintballs by there very nature are incapable of conforming to said Rifling and are unable to take advantage of the accuracy bonus it provides. In many cases it is actually detrimental to the performance of the gun and you will suffer in all categories.

If you want true accuracy ensure you gun as well as your hopper and barrel are spotless and buy the best paint you can afford, freshest and highest quality paint money can buy.

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#8 pb=life

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Posted 27 July 2012 - 02:26 AM

Take everything you know about firearm ballistics and throw it out the window, Paintballs are essentially smaller harder water balloons. There is no way to ensure perfect uniformity between each projectile and there are too many inconsistencies and variables to contend with. The reason why Rifling with firearms works because the projectiles all hit the rifling the same way conform to the groves inside the barrel and get the ideal amount of rotational force for it to "spiral" like a football until it hits the target.

Paintballs by there very nature are incapable of conforming to said Rifling and are unable to take advantage of the accuracy bonus it provides. In many cases it is actually detrimental to the performance of the gun and you will suffer in all categories.

If you want true accuracy ensure you gun as well as your hopper and barrel are spotless and buy the best paint you can afford, freshest and highest quality paint money can buy.

Hope I helped X

I'm pretty sure everyone, inlcuding myself in this thread know that. I was just further questioning it. I was wondering if under PERFECT conditions i.e. all paint has the exact same bore, no dimples, barrel was perfectly bore matched if a paintball would be more accurate.

#9 brycelarson

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Posted 27 July 2012 - 07:09 AM

I'm pretty sure everyone, inlcuding myself in this thread know that. I was just further questioning it. I was wondering if under PERFECT conditions i.e. all paint has the exact same bore, no dimples, barrel was perfectly bore matched if a paintball would be more accurate.


maybe. Obviously it's not a realistic in-game situation, but it's possible.

#10 Molybdenum

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Posted 27 July 2012 - 07:29 AM

Theoretically speaking shouldnt a rifled paintball barrel increase accuracy. This makes sense to me because back in the 1700s muskets had awful accuracy with the minie ball. As soon as rifling was introduced, accuracy was greatly increased with the minie ball. I feel like the same concept would apply with paintballs, as both the paintball and minie ball are round projectiles.


I'm pretty sure rifling was in common use when the minne was introduced. I believe it was actually designed so it could be muzzle loaded into a rifled barrel without interfering with the rifling.

That said, a minne ball would not fly well out of a smooth bore because its actually not a ball. Its a bullet shape, that will tumble if not spin stabilized.

#11 evil

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Posted 21 August 2012 - 12:30 AM

Armson made the Stealth barrel back in the early 2ks, it was just a gimmick and paint bore match meant nothing. Paintballs do not have the interferance to work correctly with rifling and they are liquid filled which if they ever achieved enough speed they would just hook off in one direction as there would be no way to spin the liquid the same speed as the hard shell. I make my own minnie and ball for my 50cal muzzle and my 41cal revolver, trust me when I say you have ALOT of interferance loading these weapons, there is just no way to have a semi solid round object achieve that level of fitment. I still have an angel stealth barrel!

#12 2thdoc

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 12:21 AM

We saw no difference in accuracy in our testing between a rifled barrel and a standard barrel. Most rifled barrels are large - so they don't really interact with the paintball the same way that a rifled barrel does with a lead bullet.

What was the size of the rifled barrel tested.... as this also comes in a .684 with bore adapters... just curious to see if resuls would differ...from previously attained...

#13 brycelarson

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Posted 02 October 2012 - 07:07 AM

What was the size of the rifled barrel tested.... as this also comes in a .684 with bore adapters... just curious to see if resuls would differ...from previously attained...


We have shot several barrels. which are you referring to?

#14 junits15

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 07:34 PM

also, when a lead bullet goes through the rifling, it actually spreads out and gets pushed into the grooves so it really spins.
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#15 Uncas

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:06 PM

On a theoretical level, I'm still not entirely convinced that rifling doesn't work. On a practical level, as far as any product that exists goes, it definitely does not work (given that the smallest bore available is .684, and paint is still sizing very small).

#16 Uncas

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:27 PM

Armson made the Stealth barrel back in the early 2ks, it was just a gimmick and paint bore match meant nothing. Paintballs do not have the interferance to work correctly with rifling and they are liquid filled which if they ever achieved enough speed they would just hook off in one direction as there would be no way to spin the liquid the same speed as the hard shell. I make my own minnie and ball for my 50cal muzzle and my 41cal revolver, trust me when I say you have ALOT of interferance loading these weapons, there is just no way to have a semi solid round object achieve that level of fitment. I still have an angel stealth barrel!


What does the rifling in the stealth barrel look like? If it's just gun rifling put in a paintball barrel and not a strong underbore, that's probably the wrong approach.

It would make sense to me that paintball rifling should be made up of many thin ridges, more of a texture really. The ball would need to be squeezed hard, and the ridges need to cut into the shell to make sure the ball doesn't just slip past (surface area is our friend). That means the ridges would have to be thinner than the shell of the ball (crappy paint would do better here). Since the ball would probably just tear apart if you had the angle of the rifling the same the whole way, I would start with straight ridges, and slowly curve them to the sharpest angle you can manage without ripping up the ball. Unfortunately, that sounds like it would be a really expensive prototype

Are you sure the liquid inside a paintball isn't viscous enough to effectively take and carry spin? And that any amount of controlled spin wouldn't be better than the uncontrolled spin we currently have?

Edited by Uncas, 15 October 2012 - 09:29 PM.


#17 UV Halo

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 09:45 AM

...they are liquid filled which if they ever achieved enough speed they would just hook off in one direction as there would be no way to spin the liquid the same speed as the hard shell....


This is not confirmed and annecdotal evidence shows that there is little effect of a paintball having a liquid fill in regards to spinning. For example, the flatline and apex barrels put plenty of spin on a paintball. Also, I've never had a problem getting a paintball to spin on a glass table by hand for longer than several seconds (which is longer than the typical flight of a paintball). Paintballs spin fine- just not from any currently produced rifled barrel without assistance (rntlee if I remember was able to use wadding and a rifled barrel to get a round to spin).

What does the rifling in the stealth barrel look like? If it's just gun rifling put in a paintball barrel and not a strong underbore, that's probably the wrong approach.

It would make sense to me that paintball rifling should be made up of many thin ridges, more of a texture really. The ball would need to be squeezed hard, and the ridges need to cut into the shell to make sure the ball doesn't just slip past (surface area is our friend). That means the ridges would have to be thinner than the shell of the ball (crappy paint would do better here). Since the ball would probably just tear apart if you had the angle of the rifling the same the whole way, I would start with straight ridges, and slowly curve them to the sharpest angle you can manage without ripping up the ball. Unfortunately, that sounds like it would be a really expensive prototype

Are you sure the liquid inside a paintball isn't viscous enough to effectively take and carry spin? And that any amount of controlled spin wouldn't be better than the uncontrolled spin we currently have?


The Armson stealth rifled barrel is a large bore (.689-690) polygonal rifling- no ridges to catch the round.

Hammerhead's rifled barrels start with a smoothbore short 'sizer' and then a .688 bore classical rifling (with ridges).

Regardless, if you made a rifled barrel that had the grip necessary to rotate the round, the main problem becomes the lack of a shell material that can handle the cut and torq imparted to the paintball.

Look at FS rounds and the LAPCO .683 rifled barrel (sold to be used with FS rounds only), assuming that the rifling actually makes the rounds spin in the barrel, the rifling shaves significant amounts of material off of the equator (the fins don't get touched by the rifling for the most part). I doubt a paintball would be able to handle this.




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