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Apex vs Rifled vs Flatline - First Strike


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#1 DJ GANDHI

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 09:18 AM

Sorry if this topic has been coverd all read, but as the title says out of the 3 which is most effective ??

If i am correct in saying that all 3 in some ways puts spin on the ball whether it using a piece of rubber like the Apex, the curviture of the barrel like the flat line or the rifling of the barrel like a hammerhead barrel. But which deos the job best and is more practical ??

But thats not the only question in this thread, would first strike rounds work in all these barrels ?? Like will a first strike round be able to be fired out a Apex barrel or a Flatline, like it can be fired out of a hammerhead.

thanks for reading.

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#2 CPS

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 09:57 AM

Rifling does nothing in paintball other then give the risk of breaking more paint. Apex and flatlines are just for standard paintballs with the apex being the most effective.

#3 madsnipes

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 11:43 AM

Apex and flatlines are just for standard paintballs with the apex being the most effective.

The apex gets a bit of getting used to plus it requires you to aim up a lot more. So for some people they might prefer the flatline.

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#4 DJ GANDHI

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 01:12 PM


Apex and flatlines are just for standard paintballs with the apex being the most effective.

The apex gets a bit of getting used to plus it requires you to aim up a lot more. So for some people they might prefer the flatline.

saything that, with the flatline you can not control the spin like on the apex, also has no-one tryd putting a first strike round in the barrel of an Apex or Flatline ?? i might give it ago if i can get hold of some FS rounds, and a Apex for that matter ;)

Edited by DJ GANDHI, 29 December 2012 - 01:12 PM.


#5 CPS

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 02:51 PM

A first strike in an apex or flatline wont work as they put backspin on the ball which would break the FS

#6 andrewthewookie

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 07:33 PM

The only rifled barrel that appears to do anything are the LAPCO barrels designed specifically with FS rounds in mind. The twist matches the angle and direction of the fins on the skirt, as opposed to random rifling in other barrels. When using normal paint you should stay away from rifled barrels anyways. As said before, the Apex and Flatline put backspin on a paintball, which creates lift on a spherical object, where the FS rounds utilize axial rotation like a bullet.

Edited by andrewthewookie, 14 January 2013 - 01:13 PM.

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#7 brycelarson

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 09:25 AM

Sorry if this topic has been coverd all read, but as the title says out of the 3 which is most effective ??


The apex and flatline give you a slight increase in max range - but no increase in accuracy. The First Strike give you a large increase in max range AND significantly increased accuracy.

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But thats not the only question in this thread, would first strike rounds work in all these barrels ?? Like will a first strike round be able to be fired out a Apex barrel or a Flatline, like it can be fired out of a hammerhead.


No, the first strike round spins along the axis of flight - the apex and flatline produce backspin.

#8 SCHULER

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 06:17 AM

The only rifled barrel that appears to do anything are the LAPCO barrels designed specifically with FS rounds in mind. The twist matches the angle and direction of the fins on the skirt, as opposed to random rifling in other barrels. When using normal paint you should stay away from rifled barrels anyways. As said before, the Apex and Flatline put backspin on a paintball, which creates lift on a spherical object, where the FS rounds utilize axial rotation like a bullet.



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#9 FreeEnterprise

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 08:10 AM

I've messed around with a hammerhead, and I wasn't impressed, but I didn't have it long, and I was using paint that works best in backspin systems... So I may have been doing it wrong...

I have a flatline, and the Apex barrels. For me, I see a huge difference between an older style stock A-5 barrel and a Apex barrel. Especially at long ranges. You just can't shoot very far with a regular barrel, but a backspin system adds distance and if you are experienced using it, you can get kills from very long ranges... Even with low cost paint.

In this video I am shooting my A-5 with a J&J barrel and an Apex 2 tape modded onto the end of it (apex at 4 clicks). I am shooting empire munitions paint (camo) and I had some old leftover premium in as tracers for this game (that is the last paintball in the video that is orange).

As you can see, I shot out the unsuspecting player all the way across a field at 250 feet away. With the FIRST shot. You can't do that with a regular barrel, no matter what bore size or paint size you are using. I get long range eliminations at just about every event I play. And use that ability to "direct" the other team, opening holes for my team to push through.

http://blip.tv/trail...50-feet-6515953


I have also messed around with tape modding an Apex 2 tip onto a new style flatline, I called it the "MonsterSpin". It is really interesting what you can do with this barrel. I can dive bomb behind bunkers at 60 feet! Crazy amount of curve. (again using regular paint, I think I was using premium in that test). This is flipping the flatline upside down for spin, and then using maximum spin on the Apex, so you are actually spinning the paint twice, which evens out the spin it seems. Pretty cool.

http://blip.tv/trail...60-feet-6322495


Here is the "monsterspin" with the Flatline regular and the apex regular, shooting "flat".

http://blip.tv/trail...latline-6344614


I normally end up using old leftover paint for my testing, as I hate to waste good paint on a test video that I find boring... But, I did use some of my good paint for a recent video test of my camera system. I wasn't really looking at the board for the first shots, as I was messing with the camera angles, and such, but you can see when I aim at the bucket, and the post, how well this paint shoots. I was just free handing all of these so they aren't "scientific" by any stretch. Just interesting...

http://blip.tv/trail...filming-6484785

#10 Exile308

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:31 PM

Rifling does nothing in paintball other then give the risk of breaking more paint. Apex and flatlines are just for standard paintballs with the apex being the most effective.



Has anyone done a fair test to show the Apex is more effective than the flatline. I am asking because the one pointed to latter in this thread doesn't use the same speed for the Flatline and the apex so it isn't a fair test.

#11 Orange Chicken

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:35 PM

I'll find the data soon, or at least attempt. I hate data-searching. But I know that the Apex at around 2 clicks is equal to the flatline, so if you max out the Apex past 2 clicks, then it puts more of a backspin=more distance=more effectiveness, in theory.

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#12 FreeEnterprise

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 09:36 AM

Not true Orange...

Their are two apex systems, the original Apex (now called the Apex 1) and the Apex 2. They are different and have different amounts of ramp.

I thought the same as you years ago, concerning the amount of ramp and that effect on distance. When the Apex 2 came out and it had more ramp I thought it would shoot further. As it would spin the ball harder.

But, it doesn't. More spin doesn't mean more distance, as there is a point where it doesn't increase range any more. I run my Apex 1 at 5 clicks, as that is the optimal setting for "flat" shooting. I run my Apex 2 at 4 clicks as it has more ramp and that is the optimal setting for the Apex 2 to shoot flat.

You can shoot very long range with an Apex 2 at 4 clicks, and you can shoot very long range with a flatline (at 270fps) Speed of your shot with a backspin system isn't as important as it is with a regular barrel. I have video showing 350 foot shots with an Apex 1 shooting 263fps. Which is pretty slow. But, I also have video shooting 350 with my marker turned up to 298fps and still it will only go 350 feet max. I have gotten shots out to about 310-325 with my flatline. The hammerhead rifled barrel also will shoot about 310-325 feet max.

I would say the Apex set where I said above is most comparable to the flatline stock setting. And the reason so many like the flatline, as it takes out the "guess work" of where to put the Apex adjuster.

All of the spinning paint barrels shoot quite a bit further than regular barrels.

The key to all of this is paint selection, and it doesn't matter what brand... You can buy one paint, and the next time you buy it, it stinks... Paint variation kills our accuracy. Once you get GOOD paint, and shoot it, you will realize just how important paint selection is on your "skill" hitting your target. But, finding good paint is extremely hard.

Both the stock apex barrels and the flatline are large bore barrels, and the Apex stock barrels are stepped, so they are large at the breech end, and smaller at the opening, just like a stock barrel on a Tippmann. Going to a higher end barrel often means it is the same size all the way through, which if you buy paint that matches that bore size, it will shoot better than a stepped barrel... IF the paint is good...

It all goes back to paint.


Yes, you can shoot far with the systems out there that spin the ball, and you can shoot far with first strike. Each has its own benefits and drawbacks. I think the most interesting system is my Monsterspin system (flatline with apex 2 tape modded on it) but since I haven't figured out how to mount my ZoomCam to it, I haven't used it in any games. But, being able to shoot behind bunkers at 60 feet is insane. And then you can shoot flat with it as well, reaching out to 350 feet max when set correctly with good paint.

Edited by FreeEnterprise, 07 March 2013 - 09:38 AM.


#13 Orange Chicken

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 10:01 AM

Still, I still find the apex/apex2, if they can go the same distance as the flatline, to be more practical.

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#14 FreeEnterprise

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 10:01 PM

Regular paint, using co2, Tippmann A-5 paintball guns with Apex 2 barrels.







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