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dye proto rail pmr

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#1 ASIAN invASIANx

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Posted 04 September 2013 - 11:50 PM

i want to get a dye rail, but when i search for it on ebay, other names such as proto rail or pro to rail pmr. whats the difference, if any?



#2 kingJurzy

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Posted 04 September 2013 - 11:53 PM

Proto is owned by Dye and the marker is called a Proto Rail not a Dye rail.


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#3 andrewthewookie

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Posted 04 September 2013 - 11:53 PM

Proto is a brand that Dye uses for their lower end stuff. All the Rails and PMRs are Proto. The only current Dye gun is the Matrix line.


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#4 kingJurzy

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Posted 04 September 2013 - 11:54 PM

ninja'd you Wookie


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#5 ASIAN invASIANx

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Posted 04 September 2013 - 11:55 PM

Proto is a brand that Dye uses for their lower end stuff. All the Rails and PMRs are Proto. The only current Dye gun is the Matrix line.

whats a PMR? and whats the difference between them and rails?



#6 Pumpy

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Posted 05 September 2013 - 12:01 AM

The PMR is the higher end version of the rail, but not a true high end like the DM series.



#7 andrewthewookie

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Posted 05 September 2013 - 12:02 AM

Right now, Proto has two guns: the Reflex (mid range), and the Rail (low end). They're both blow-forwards with similar (if not identical) bolts. The difference comes from how nice the guns are, the extras, etc. The PMRs were basically what the Reflex is now.

 

Dye's manual page shows how they're grouped. http://www.dyepaintb...m/dyematrix.php


Edited by andrewthewookie, 05 September 2013 - 12:05 AM.

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#8 CaptainKay

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Posted 05 September 2013 - 01:29 AM

PMR stands for Proto Matrix Rail if I'm not mistaken.

#9 Old Dude PB

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Posted 05 September 2013 - 08:57 AM

The Rail brand is an interesting little study in marketing. One of Dye's goals with Proto is apparently to make their branding as confusing as possible, and we see this achieved in the history of the Rails. Depending on how you count, you'll run into at least three, if not five or six, different Proto guns with the word "Rail" in the name. All are single-reg (no LPR) unbalanced spool valves.

  1. The original Proto Matrix Rail was released in late 2006 with a 2007 model year. It had a grip frame that looked like the stock frame from the PM6/DM5, and many plastic ("composite") parts. The back cap, in particular, proved to be problematic, with many stripping after a little use. For around $150, you could upgrade the grip to a Dye branded, UL style grip frame, similar to what had become the stock grip on the PMs (on the PM8) and DMs (since the DM6). This might be where you're coming up with the idea of a "Dye Rail." An 07 or 08 PMR with the upgraded UL frame would say "Dye" on it.
  2. In late 2007/early 2008, Dye introduced the Limited Edition and Special Edition PMRs. I'm not sure of the exact distinction between the limited and special editions, but in general they replaced many of the plastic parts with aluminum (back cap, trigger, feedneck collar). The 11-inch one-piece barrel from the original PMR was replaced by a Proto-branded 14-inch 2-piece barrel which was essentially a Dye UL under a different badge. In my opinion, the Klingon battle axe triggers (and guards) from the LE and SE PMRs hold the distinction of being the ugliest components ever released on any widely-available gun.
  3. In 2008, Proto released the sear-tripping SLG as a low-end option, so they needed to differentiate the PMR in some way to hit a mid-end price point. Basically, they made the UL frame standard on the Special/Limited Edition (thereby relieving the paintball world of ever again having to see that trigger) and called it the 2009 PMR. Metal parts, two-piece barrel, UL frame, on/off ASA. The 2010 PMR is basically the same gun. Up to this point, the bolt/firing system of all the PMRs has remained the same. The easy way to tell that you have a pre-2011 Proto Matrix Rail is that there is a manifold sticking down from the bolt tail. When you insert the bolt assembly into the back of the gun, you need to make sure that the manifold lines up over the air hole in the frame. There's an index screw to help with this. Later Rail bolts are radially symmetrical and lack that manifold, so you can insert them without lining anything up.
  4. By 2010, the SLG had failed as a product. Some people had a good experience with them, but many SLGs were returned (some repeatedly) for service. There was a not-firing/auto-venting/runaway-gun feature that people didn't appreciate much. So 2011 was a watershed year for the Rail brand. The bolt was redesigned, losing the asymmetrical manifold, and the line was split in two. What had been the 2010 Proto Matrix Rail was re-badged as the Proto Reflex Rail (Now with Higher Price Feature!). The 2011 Proto Rail (no "Reflex," no "Matrix") became the low-end offering to replace the SLG. Same new bolt as the Reflex Rail, and a plastic verson of the UL frame, but with a more robust, slower pancake solenoid, and board with a lower ROF cap. One of the problems with the earlier Rails in the hands of new/young users was that without an LPR, it was easy to overpressurize the gun, causing leaks and endangering the solenoid. So they dumbed it down for the low-end market.
  5. Up until 2011, all of the Dye/Proto guns looked very similar, externally. To an untrained eye, an original Rail didn't look that different from a top of the line DM. In 2011, someone at Dye decided to clear that up. Hence the (goofy) badging all over the Rail and Reflex Rail, and the dropping of the word "Matrix" from both.

That brings us up to date. Here's how you can tell which Rail you're looking at on eBay:

 

Any Proto gun with an LPR is a Proto Matrix (PM5 - PM8), not any variety of Rail.

Any PMR with an asymmetrical manifold sticking down from the bolt tail is a pre-2011.

Any PMR with a non-UL frame is either an '07 or '08.

Plastic "monkey club" trigger = original '07 Proto Matrix Rail.

Terrifying Klingon battle trigger = '08 Limited/Special Edition Proto Matrix Rail

UL Frame + Asymmetrical bolt manifold = '09 or '10 Proto Matrix Rail OR '07/'08 PMR with upgraded frame

Goofy "RAIL" badge = 2011 Proto Rail

Goofy "REFLEX" badge = 2011-13 Proto Reflex Rail

 

It can get a little confusing on the pre-2011 PMRs, if there have been upgrades. But there really isn't that much difference between a 2010 PMR and a 2007 PMR with a UL frame. Just stay away from the plastic backcap and feedneck collar, if you can. Here's my short course on Proto guns: If you're comfortable buying used, DON'T buy a Rail. For half of what you'll pay for a new Reflex Rail, a used PM8 is pretty close to being a DM.


Edited by Old Dude PB, 05 September 2013 - 09:48 AM.






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