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I need a good inexpensive speedball gun. Please help


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#101 Orange Chicken

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 11:43 PM

The kaos pump is pretty awesome, and great if you want a new pump. It has a smooth pump stroke, which is nice. The problem is, you could get a lot better if you just go on ebay and look up an autococker sniper, because in comparison, the Azodin Kaos Pump is just loud, has a double trigger, heavier than my Axe, has no anti double feed feature, and the feedneck left much to be desired for. Still, for the 50 bucks I picked it up from a garage sale new, it's a rather okay pump.

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#102 MrKnoxville917

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Posted 15 June 2014 - 07:23 AM

Hey man I'm new to the sport too so I know what your going through searching and comparing every gun on the market. Here is my advice take it leave it. Go to your local pro shop. Talk to some veteran PBers and see if they will let you hold and shoot a few guns. Ask them if they have any extra stuff they may be selling. My local shop has a pin board with all kinds of people selling guns n gear. The research part is long and full of knowledge but will only take you so far. You need to get the hands on feel of the markers you may be thinking of buying. I just got an axe off of craigslist I have had it 2 weeks and I feel like I couldn't of went with a better choice. I held a mini and it was way to small for my hands but the axe for perfect. Lots of people at my local field have them and I haven't heard a complaint from any of them. I scored mine for 300 bucks and the dude hadn't even put a case through it. Another thing be paitient with your marker purchase bc you don't wanna jump into something then not like it and lose your ass on it trying to trade or sell it.

#103 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 15 June 2014 - 07:35 AM

Very true, very true 👍 thanks (:

#104 Orange Chicken

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Posted 15 June 2014 - 06:09 PM

Well see this is what I did when I started. I didn't really trust local word. I never do. I asked around online, on forums such as this, because opinions are prone to judgement and adjustment until there's a more trustable consensus of an idea. Then I went to my proshop and local field to hold and have personal experience with the item of interest. Then I bought it after I decided I really wanted it. The reason why I don't really trust local word in matters like products is because people tell each other what the "best" is and it's never really questioned. Everyone at my field hails Planet Eclipse markers, and I didn't really like any of them with continued research and experience. But for years I believed they were the greatest. Everyone at my field hates Dye markers, but upon actually trying them, and research online to confirm, they're actually kind of awesome. Smooth and comfortable in the hands. I'm one of the only guys at my field with an Axe, and I find it to be quite good, despite people locally saying I should get an Etek4 because they're better because it's "from Planet Eclipse and they make the best markers".
Now as to paint, listen to that locally. For example, it's locally known that you either buy the lowest end stuff or get the highest end stuff, because the mid grade stuff seems to always suck. And it does.

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#105 Forrest99

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Posted 15 June 2014 - 06:12 PM

Honest to god the best gun for 200$ is either a marq 6 or Dm6-8 if you can find an 8 for around there. They will run circles around any new low end

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#106 RussnLgnTimmy

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 02:30 PM

Sign up with intimidator owners group and grab a gen 2 or 3 intimidator for 285-325 depending on upgrades. You wont regret it.

Empire mini- ive played a few games with one, put maybe 600-700 rounds through it in semi, very smooth quiet marker, the stock barrel, though pretty accurate, has absolutely no range. Id recommend a dye ultralite barrel if you go with the mini.

Dp g5- played a saturday of airball/speedball with a friends new g5 a couple of weeks ago. Put 2200 rounds through it and not a single chop. Never had the bolt stick on me or any problem like that. Having said that i DID just use it for the day, i couldn't tell you how one with 8-10 cases will perform but from what little hands on experience i had with it, it was great. Smooth, quiet, and accurate as hell (he did have a freak kit and a rotor on it though, so with a cheaper hopper and stock barrel, i really couldn't tell you. Hope this helps a little.

Edited by RussnLgnTimmy, 16 June 2014 - 03:30 PM.


#107 BurningPlaydoh

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 04:33 PM

Sign up with intimidator owners group and grab a gen 2 or 3 intimidator for 285-325 depending on upgrades. You wont regret it.

Empire mini- ive played a few games with one, put maybe 600-700 rounds through it in semi, very smooth quiet marker, the stock barrel, though pretty accurate, has absolutely no range. Id recommend a dye ultralite barrel if you go with the mini.

Dp g5- played a saturday of airball/speedball with a friends new g5 a couple of weeks ago. Put 2200 rounds through it and not a single chop. Never had the bolt stick on me or any problem like that. Having said that i DID just use it for the day, i couldn't tell you how one with 8-10 cases will perform but from what little hands on experience i had with it, it was great. Smooth, quiet, and accurate as hell (he did have a freak kit and a rotor on it though, so with a cheaper hopper and stock barrel, i really couldn't tell you. Hope this helps a little.


Please stop perpetuating completely incorrect information.

#108 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 05:07 PM

Sign up with intimidator owners group and grab a gen 2 or 3 intimidator for 285-325 depending on upgrades. You wont regret it.

Empire mini- ive played a few games with one, put maybe 600-700 rounds through it in semi, very smooth quiet marker, the stock barrel, though pretty accurate, has absolutely no range. Id recommend a dye ultralite barrel if you go with the mini.

Dp g5- played a saturday of airball/speedball with a friends new g5 a couple of weeks ago. Put 2200 rounds through it and not a single chop. Never had the bolt stick on me or any problem like that. Having said that i DID just use it for the day, i couldn't tell you how one with 8-10 cases will perform but from what little hands on experience i had with it, it was great. Smooth, quiet, and accurate as hell (he did have a freak kit and a rotor on it though, so with a cheaper hopper and stock barrel, i really couldn't tell you. Hope this helps a little.

Do you know anything about the 2011 proto rail ? That seems to be the winner for me as of right now. Idk why really. I just like it i guess from reading about it :)

#109 get.lit.up!

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 07:03 PM

The rail, you mean the dye ion?
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#110 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 07:11 PM

The rail, you mean the dye ion?

The dye proto matrix rail. Dye PMR. 2011

#111 RussnLgnTimmy

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 08:24 PM

Please stop perpetuating completely incorrect information.

Could have easily been bad paint to bore match, either way it was not accurate, everyone that used it that day complained at some point or another how bad it was. Put a dye ultralite on it halfway through the day and it was a brand new marker for back players. Im sorry though you have way more posts than me, i don't know anything about anything.

Edited by RussnLgnTimmy, 16 June 2014 - 08:28 PM.


#112 tallsmallboy44

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 08:28 PM

 

Please stop perpetuating completely incorrect information.

Could have easily been bad paint to bore match, either way it was not accurate, everyone that used it that day complained at some point or another how bad it was. Put a dye ultralite on it halfway through the day and it was a brand new marker for back players. Im sorry though you have way more posts than me, i don't know anything about anything.

 

The paint to bore match has nothing to do with it.


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#113 Justbunkeredyou

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 10:00 PM

Mini GS




#114 get.lit.up!

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:23 PM


The rail, you mean the dye ion?

The dye proto matrix rail. Dye PMR. 2011
It was a shot at dye because the rail pretty much an ion
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#115 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:38 PM


The rail, you mean the dye ion?

The dye proto matrix rail. Dye PMR. 2011
It was a shot at dye because the rail pretty much an ion
Lol. Well, what's your opinion on how it operates?

#116 get.lit.up!

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 11:57 PM

I wouldn't mind shooting one (since they are not bad) , but on the other hand I would not buy one personally.

They are part of the rental fleet at my field as well, not to knock it anyways just facts
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#117 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 12:19 AM

I wouldn't mind shooting one (since they are not bad) , but on the other hand I would not buy one personally.

They are part of the rental fleet at my field as well, not to knock it anyways just facts

Ah. Well, at my field the rentals are all tippmanns. I just want a nice. Inexpensive speedball marker to play with occasionally.

#118 unfated33

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 08:58 AM

You really have two choices for being able to walk a trigger in mechanical - either an Automag or the Tippmann Crossover.  There are a lot of similarities in the performance of those two markers, but the Crossover will be newer and have a modern warranty.  The GOG eNMEy has a pretty quick trigger but I don't think it's that much faster than the Azodin KD-II or a Tippmann 98c.


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#119 get.lit.up!

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 10:29 PM

Oh buddy you are sadly mistaken. Considering I can almost out shoot a revvy with the eNMEy over the uncomfortable and heavier pull of the 98. I'd rock the eNMEy over the 98 anytime
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#120 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 10:39 PM

Haha. I like the look of the Enemy. And I like the pull on my 98 custom. I honestly can shoot about 10bps with a single trigger 98 custom. Don't ask me how. Lol. I don't know. But hey. Can you guys check out my new post about painting my 98 custom :) thanks

#121 Orange Chicken

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Posted 18 June 2014 - 02:58 AM

But you can very comfortable shoot that fast with an enmey. It has a one pound trigger pull, maybe even less if you mess with the spring in the trigger. And it is hella smooth. And quiet. and light. and...just better.


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#122 unfated33

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Posted 18 June 2014 - 07:16 AM

I think I was a little unclear before in how I worded things.  The eNMEy trigger is better than the Kaos-D and the 98c.  I'm fairly certain but have no information on if the eNMEy trigger is better than the KD-II.  The Crossover trigger is even better than that (with the spring removed).  Most days I don't even bother with a battery anymore.


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#123 RussnLgnTimmy

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 09:22 AM


 

Please stop perpetuating completely incorrect information.

Could have easily been bad paint to bore match, either way it was not accurate, everyone that used it that day complained at some point or another how bad it was. Put a dye ultralite on it halfway through the day and it was a brand new marker for back players. Im sorry though you have way more posts than me, i don't know anything about anything.
 
The paint to bore match has nothing to do with it.

Wow. Paint to bore match has nothing to do with range or accuracy? Please tell me more about your infinite wisdom.

#124 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 01:26 AM

What's everyones opinion on the azodin blitz evo ? Seems to have pretty good reviews

#125 ClayCallison

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 04:05 AM

The cheapest speedball gun that will actually perform was the SmartParts vibe, but since they're GOG now, I'd say it's the Spyder Fenix.  If money isn't an issue go with the AXE you literally can't go wrong with it if you decide it's not for you, you can get almost all your money back they lose almost no value!


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#126 PREDATOR 47

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 09:17 AM

 

 

 

Please stop perpetuating completely incorrect information.

Could have easily been bad paint to bore match, either way it was not accurate, everyone that used it that day complained at some point or another how bad it was. Put a dye ultralite on it halfway through the day and it was a brand new marker for back players. Im sorry though you have way more posts than me, i don't know anything about anything.
 
The paint to bore match has nothing to do with it.

Wow. Paint to bore match has nothing to do with range or accuracy? Please tell me more about your infinite wisdom.

 

 

No. It doesn't make a difference. While I could go on for days about my total omniscience, that's not the topic at hand. The reason we say that barrels don't affect accuracy, is because it's been tested and shown to have no effect. But, judging by your tone, you must know something that we don't. So, I'm curious as to how you think barrels do affect accuracy.

 

Also, 

 

 

 

The cheapest speedball gun that will actually perform was the SmartParts vibe, but since they're GOG now, I'd say it's the Spyder Fenix.  If money isn't an issue go with the AXE you literally can't go wrong with it if you decide it's not for you, you can get almost all your money back they lose almost no value!

 

So, since Smart Parts is GoG now, they're version of the Vibe, now known as the eNVy, isn't as good? The Spyder Fenix is trash, and GoG makes the best guns you can get for under 250 new in my opinion. The eXTCy should be sub-200 now since it has been discontinued, and as always the used market is a great way to get an awesome gun for not a lot of money.



#127 unfated33

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 09:41 AM

Well, except the eNVy has also been discontinued and is increasingly difficult to find.  I think we'd all agree that the deals now should be better for them, not worse.  If I read OP right, though - wanting a low cost speedball marker that also has or can be mechanical - the Crossover is the only marker that makes any sense.


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#128 ClayCallison

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 02:08 PM

 

 

 

 

Please stop perpetuating completely incorrect information.

Could have easily been bad paint to bore match, either way it was not accurate, everyone that used it that day complained at some point or another how bad it was. Put a dye ultralite on it halfway through the day and it was a brand new marker for back players. Im sorry though you have way more posts than me, i don't know anything about anything.
 
The paint to bore match has nothing to do with it.

Wow. Paint to bore match has nothing to do with range or accuracy? Please tell me more about your infinite wisdom.

 

 

No. It doesn't make a difference. While I could go on for days about my total omniscience, that's not the topic at hand. The reason we say that barrels don't affect accuracy, is because it's been tested and shown to have no effect. But, judging by your tone, you must know something that we don't. So, I'm curious as to how you think barrels do affect accuracy.

 

Also, 

 

 

 

The cheapest speedball gun that will actually perform was the SmartParts vibe, but since they're GOG now, I'd say it's the Spyder Fenix.  If money isn't an issue go with the AXE you literally can't go wrong with it if you decide it's not for you, you can get almost all your money back they lose almost no value!

 

So, since Smart Parts is GoG now, they're version of the Vibe, now known as the eNVy, isn't as good? The Spyder Fenix is trash, and GoG makes the best guns you can get for under 250 new in my opinion. The eXTCy should be sub-200 now since it has been discontinued, and as always the used market is a great way to get an awesome gun for not a lot of money.

 

The eXTCy was $250 not $150 like the vibe.


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#129 PREDATOR 47

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 03:36 PM

 

 

 

 

 

Please stop perpetuating completely incorrect information.

Could have easily been bad paint to bore match, either way it was not accurate, everyone that used it that day complained at some point or another how bad it was. Put a dye ultralite on it halfway through the day and it was a brand new marker for back players. Im sorry though you have way more posts than me, i don't know anything about anything.
 
The paint to bore match has nothing to do with it.

Wow. Paint to bore match has nothing to do with range or accuracy? Please tell me more about your infinite wisdom.

 

 

No. It doesn't make a difference. While I could go on for days about my total omniscience, that's not the topic at hand. The reason we say that barrels don't affect accuracy, is because it's been tested and shown to have no effect. But, judging by your tone, you must know something that we don't. So, I'm curious as to how you think barrels do affect accuracy.

 

Also, 

 

 

 

The cheapest speedball gun that will actually perform was the SmartParts vibe, but since they're GOG now, I'd say it's the Spyder Fenix.  If money isn't an issue go with the AXE you literally can't go wrong with it if you decide it's not for you, you can get almost all your money back they lose almost no value!

 

So, since Smart Parts is GoG now, they're version of the Vibe, now known as the eNVy, isn't as good? The Spyder Fenix is trash, and GoG makes the best guns you can get for under 250 new in my opinion. The eXTCy should be sub-200 now since it has been discontinued, and as always the used market is a great way to get an awesome gun for not a lot of money.

 

The eXTCy was $250 not $150 like the vibe.

 

The eXTCy is not the same as the Vibe, it's more similar to the Ion. The Vibe is comparable to the eNVy.



#130 RussnLgnTimmy

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 11:28 AM

Based on pure physics, a .688 ball shot out of a .692 barrel will allow air to escape around the ball due the 4 thousandths difference of the id of the barrel. A .688 ball shot out of a .687 barrel allows all the air to be behind the ball instead of escaping around the ball. Pure science tells you one of those situations is more efficient than the other. Ive been a machinist for the last seven years making real gun barrels for Glock, Mossberg, kel-tec and Remington, trust me their research and development departments know more about projectile to inner diameter barrel matching and its affect on range/accuracy/efficiency than some dude with a youtube account.

Edited by RussnLgnTimmy, 21 June 2014 - 11:30 AM.


#131 PREDATOR 47

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 01:19 PM

Efficiency does not equate to accuracy. Air escaping around the ball does not change the trajectory of the paintball, nor will keeping the air trapped behind it. Before you talk about spin allow me to clarify that as well. It takes thousands of RPM's to spin a paintball enough to change its trajectory, as demonstrated by the Flatline and Apex barrels. Anything less than that, caused by things such as air escaping around the projectile and gimmicks such as Jack Rice's "Sweep Bolt" do not impart enough spin to change trajectory. Rifling makes no difference unless First Strikes are involved, and a barrel being "smoother" also will not be enough to change the trajectory of a paintball. Barrels do not change accuracy, it's as simple as that.

 

Also, "that guy" with a YouTube account has done a bit of research himself. And the results of his research are reflected in the majority of paintball barrels currently being produced. 

 

Lastly, being a machinist does not make you a physicist. If you know so much about firearms, it should be obvious that bullets do not compare to paintballs in any way whatsoever. Things that will make a firearm more accurate will not always help when applied to paintball, like rifling. Bullets are more aerodynamic, heavier, faster, not always frangible, and can be spun using rifling due to the fact that they are solid. 

 

Paintballs on the other hand, are somewhat round, liquid filled, frangible by requirement (which negates the effective use of rifling), lighter, slower, and the aerodynamics leave a lot to be desired. The biggest problem with ignorance in paintball ballistics is the attempted application of things that work with firearms into paintball. Again, First Strikes are a different story altogether, but paintball ballistics are significantly different from firearms. When it comes to paintball, forget everything you know about firearms. 



#132 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 01:23 PM

Is it bad that when I read either of your guys statements. I believe both ? Lol. Lets just be peaceful <3

#133 PREDATOR 47

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 01:27 PM

Is it bad that when I read either of your guys statements. I believe both ? Lol. Lets just be peaceful <3

 

No peace.

 



#134 Baby Jesus Swag

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 01:37 PM

Lol. Well. All I know is I like my barrels a tight fight. I like me a .685 barrel. Paint is nice in that barrel for me. The stock barrels i feel are so inaccurate at like .691 or .693 because of te extra room. Idk about effiency cuz I really don't care. My field fills it for free. I do like me my apex 2 barrel though. Does add a little distance. I was hitting people from the ground up in a window about 75 feet away :)

#135 Orange Chicken

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Posted 22 June 2014 - 12:43 PM

Well those stock barrels are no more or less accurate, just bigger you actually get a marginal reduction in sound at the cost of a small bit of efficiency. And efficiency always matters. Well at least if your using a not so efficient marker. I need my guns to get at least 3 pods and a hopper for at least two games for me not to be at least a little annoyed, despite my field filling it for free.

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#136 The Rec-Baller 217

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Posted 23 June 2014 - 05:08 PM

I stick with the stock barrel my marker comes with... why do i do that... because i don't feel the need to spend 50 , 100, or even 200 dollars on a barrel kit. Maybe when i have money thats burning a hole in my pocket ill get a tighter barrel back.



#137 dahveed

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Posted 23 June 2014 - 05:32 PM

D3S By d3fy ports.. can't beat it for 289.00  with an aftermarket tadao board.. http://www.ultimatep...tball-guns.aspx



#138 stevencjones

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 11:47 PM

The axe definately isnt small.

#139 Orange Chicken

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 01:17 AM

You cant walk the trigger on a mechanical marker because that isn't possible with the design. However, with an enmey, you can, if you have at least a decent trigger finger, reach high rates of fire pretty easily because it has a short and light trigger pull.


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#140 Jawz

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 03:00 PM

dont forget that tippmann gun.... What was the name again?


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