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LPR and Dwell Simply Explained


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#1 EKKsoldier622

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Posted 07 December 2008 - 11:06 PM

Alright, I am an avid Dm shooter and have been compiling basic information for people coming into the spool valve (more importantly the Dye/Proto) side of the market. I'm currently working on the LPR and Dwell part of things.
I was just sick of looking through threads from peoples varying advice and needed a "Cut & Dry" way to look at things.

The truth is the corrleation between HPR/LPR/Dwell is very complicated so take what you are about to read as very simple, the best way to know how these things work is by finding a sense of balance, sometimes by raising something you must counter it by lowering something else. The best way to recognize what you want is to read the bottom of this post to find out how you want your gun setup.


*There are no best settings (So asking someone what are the best settings will not apply to everyone because everybody has different want/needs in a gun and even if these needs/wants were the same, no two guns are the same.


Dwell: This is the time (in milliseconds) the solenoid stays open to allow air to the bolt.

Lower Dwell
+More Efficient (More Shots Per Fill)


Higher Dwell

-Less Efficient (Less shots Per Fill)



LPR: Also called the Low Pressure Regulator, this is the amount of air used to hold the bolt back and then when the solenoid is activated (pulling the trigger) this air is then channeled through a different passage way via the solenoid to push the bolt forward. On Dm's/Pm's, LPR is measured by "Turns Out". This means that if I screw my LPR adjustment knob all the way in, until it is snug, and then I unscrew it 3 full rotations, then I have an LPR setting of 3 turns out.

Posted Image

Lower LPR
+More Efficient
-Less Consistent (The FPS deviation between shots varies more; Ex: 268,285,277,250,295)
+More gentle on paint

Higher LPR
-Less Efficient
+More Consistent (The FPS deviation between shots varies less; Ex: 298,295,297,298,299)
-Less Gentle on paint

2 Ways To Reduce Kick:

1. The higher the dwell, the lower you can turn the LPR down; so the bolt moves a little slower for a little longer. This is how the Ironmen tune their guns (Dwell:19-21 LPR:2-3; Basically they set their dwell then lower their LPR til it drops-off then raise it about a 1/4 of a turn)

2. You can decrease the HPR pressure, this will in turn lower the psi in the dump chamber which will result in less kick

Both of these methods will make the marker quieter and softer on paint at the expense of not being as efficient.


2 Ways To Increase Efficiency
1. **Top Hat Rings on the bolt. This is a popular method used to increase efficiency. It decreases the amount of volume in the bolt's dump chamber. This makes you raise your HPR. Will result in more kick. (These rings are sold in packs of 3, but usually only 2 are used)

Top Hat Rings
+More Efficient
-More Kick
-Less Fragile on Paint


2.




Please correct me if any parts are wrong. This is a compilation of things I know and have read on various sites, so some of it could be wrong.

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#2 staples

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Posted 30 December 2008 - 08:48 PM

Very helpful...needs to be stickied :D
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#3 rquily

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Posted 30 December 2008 - 09:19 PM

that's pretty much the basics. I know it on the back of my mind while messing with my Fusion07. But for some reason, I can't explain it as detailed as you just did. I didn't know though that the dwell and the LPR are correlated. I thought only the LPR and HPR are! I guess I'll need to turn my dwell up since my fusion(poppet) is already efficient enough! I need it to kick less and more consistent... <---

But really some people like to keep it stock but i guess once they get to know their gun, they want it to perform better when it comes to what they need

#4 jcdub0319

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Posted 11 January 2009 - 09:36 AM

I'm new to DM's Actually haven't even received my DM9 yet. But when I get it, I think I'm going to tune it to be consistent and smooth, what settings would I have to use for that? And how will the efficiency go down? Will I possibly get 6-8 pods off a 68/45?

#5 Z3R0

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Posted 11 January 2009 - 10:16 AM

I have my PM8 on a dwell of 25ms and the LPR turned down quite a bit... actually I tested it with some decently fresh Stinger and it just pinched the paint (I put the ball halfway into the breech, turned the marker sideways so the ball just sat there half-fed, and pulled the trigger), so my LPR must be pretty low. I haven't actually checked how many turns out it is though. I'm getting +-2 or +-3 using fresh Stinger in a .685 Matchstick barrel with only 4-5 cases through the marker so my consistency is still good. I find with these settings it shoots much smoother than at dwell 18 with the LPR a little higher, and I'm not noticing much of an efficiency loss... so feel free to experiment with higher dwell/lower pressure and see how it works out for you. I'm loving the smooth, quiet shot, even if it does mean losing a few shots per tank fill. I generally play snake and often make it through a round of rec. speedball on under a hopper of paint, and air is free all day, so efficiency isn't that big of a deal to me.

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#6 m40kc

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Posted 29 July 2009 - 11:01 PM

Hey man, I read the post, and Im pretty sure that higher lpr is more efficient but less gentle on paint, and lower lpr is less effecient but more gentle on paint.
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#7 CyberTroop

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Posted 27 August 2009 - 02:42 AM

2 Ways To Reduce Kick:

1. The higher the dwell, the lower you can turn the LPR down; so the bolt moves a little slower for a little longer. This is how the Ironmen tune their guns (Dwell:19-21 LPR:2-3; Basically they set their dwell then lower their LPR til it drops-off then raise it about a 1/4 of a turn)

2. You can decrease the HPR pressure, this will in turn lower the psi in the dump chamber which will result in less kick

Both of these methods will make the marker quieter and softer on paint at the expense of not being as efficient.


Hello, I've got some questions about this.

So basically, if I follow step 1, this will result in less kick, quieter, softer and more consistent?

Also, when you say turn the LPR down, are you referring to turning it downwards lower, or turning it lower in terms of PSI.

Thank you.

#8 chewiestmonkey

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Posted 14 June 2010 - 11:41 PM

a higher dwell shouldnt really make a DM less efficient, since the shot chamber is essentialy closed off from the main air supply by the tail orings.

since the matrix is a balanced spool
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